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rish either (2) or (3), even

I am actually rather happy with number 2. Not because I am gay myself but becasue at least a short spell of showing the party has modernised and is now inclusive is paramount. It is precisley because of some of the comments on here that Cameron needs to do this, at least in the short term, to show the party has moved on and is not stuck in some past bigoted century.

After that then of course people privatley can do, and should do as they wish.. But at least a short term move is needed to show people that this party is at least semi connected to modern Britain. Thank You I say.

And yes fair enough I am not religious. But it has always struck me as rather narrow minded to believe that there should be no change and only relgious fundementalism is appropriate for polciy making. This discounts I believe a comprehensive understanding of political philosophy.

I was puzzled by the mentions on the site of David Cameron attending a homosexual event. so went back to item 2 on the list and clicked on the word in green "this".

And there it is. He will attend the Gay Pride event on June 30th "Pride at the Paramount" and will appear on the platform.

What next I wonder - support for "Operation Black Vote"?

Anything to get elected it seems. Sorry, I feel slightly sick.

After all those comments the number of bloggers approving this ragbag wholeheartedly is tiny whereas those dismissing it as 'drivel' and 'rubbish' are a major proportion. The balance appear to be somewhat unhappy. .

Could somebody from the blog make this balance known to the leader if that someone can get past the cohorts of Black teenage drug-riddled Green Lesbians who apparently run CCHQ

1. Further promotion of women and ethnic minority Conservatives.
Making the party attractive to ethnic minorities would be a start. Toning down the anti-immigrant rhetoric would help here.

2. Outreach to gay rights groups

Outreach is all very well, but how does this impact Tory policy? Is he in favour of gay marriage, gay adoption, rights for gay people in religious organisations? The bannin of homophobic teaching in religious schools? Or is this just WWAOD again?


3. More emphasis on environmental policies. At Spring Forum in Cheltenham Greg Clark MP promised to make Britain the "Saudi Arabia of renewable energy."

Chopping peoples hands off if they don't take the recylcling out? This will require vast sums of public money. We need concrete, not hot air.

4. Cameron-and-NHSLoud trumpeting of the fact that the NHS and international development are the top two Tory spending priorities.

Good, if only because it irritates the regulars here so much! Daniel Hannan must be frothing - sorry I'll start again - DH must be frothing even more than usual to read this, as he thinks the NHS is a 60-year old waste of space.

5. More initiatives on social justice with a greater role for Iain Duncan Smith.

This sesms to be the antidote to point 2 - social engineering combined with an abrogation of the government's responsibilties to the its least advantaged citizens. The third sector has a role, but doesn't have the skills or resources to cope.

Cameron's playing defense too much. He is not on the attack he is still counter punching. He has his opponent on the ropes and instead of going for the knockout, he is hoping to win by a split decision. Like other posters have stated, this is all about rebranding. Whoever came up with the label "nasty party" should receive a full guaranteed pension from Labour. Instead of running around trying to prove to everyone that the Tories are not mean, why not simply find a label and rebrand Labour? Treason party? Blame Britain first party? StasiLabour? The party that declared war on Britain? Fifth column Labour? Has Cameron ever read Tzu?

Those who called it 'the nasty party' should stand in the corner with a dunce's hat on and be made to do a bit of Maoist self criticism. But it won'y happen since Cameron has let the party be taken over by the aforesaid "cohorts of Black teenage drug-riddled Green Lesbians who apparently run CCHQ"

Most comments on here have acted like they thought this was the main policy list, myself included. Of those, for the few that think it's a good list well never mind, at least you seem to be in a minority. The rest of us seem fairly critical albeit with a mix if ideas on what might be more appropriate.

Then Tim and Susan come on and suggest that this is some sort of 'B-list', a sort of Cameron-esque mood music for the real 'A-list' which they would have us believe is obvious. Someone even suggested this was some sort of sop to the floating lefties and that the real iron fist would come out once the election was won.

Putting aside the dishonesty of this latter, even if there is some A-list, then enough were fooled here to give pause for thought. At the very least, communication sucks and the faithful have a real issue of perception to deal with. Shouting at us won't make the 'A-list' any more real.

If this is the B-list, then why are important issues like social justice and health on it?

No, I don't buy it. The Conservatives have a real problem with a unifying vision and a lack of clear, strong leadership and any obvious action on things like expenses and social justice are symptomatic of this. The front bench are too busy scoring points off Brown to ensure he loses than worrying about how they might win.

If there is an A-list then it needs to be the only thing that gets talked about until the election is won. Then when you get in and people find that you are even nice to women, gays and small furry animals and not the nasty party, it will come as a pleasant surprise. Good people and strong, resonant policies will win this. Let's get to it.

A few weeks ago a man sent a 100ft tall model rocket into the atmosphere. The obvious question was - "when does a model rocket become just a rocket?"

So now we have a green, socially liberal, pro-gay, feminist, anti-Christian Conservative party.

So the obvious question now is - "When does a conservative political party become left wing"?

You might say - "we're free market!! - that's the difference!". But conservatives aren't free market because they're pro free-market, they're free market because they believe that's the best form of economic system to sustain a conservative society. It's not axiomatic, or dogmatic.

You might say - "we're libertarians!! - that's the difference!". But conservatives aren't libertarians because they're pro libertarian, they're libertarian because they believe that's the best form of social system to sustain a conservative society. It's not axiomatic, or dogmatic.

I'm a conservative. I'm looking for a party that promotes and holds conservative values. Not a party that just promotes the free market, or just promotes libertarianism. Those aren't tenets of conservatism, those are just possible means to conservative ends.

Show me your conservative credentials Mr Cameron. Show me your pro-life, pro-Christian, pro-marriage, patriotic, strong borders, law and order, pro-morality, anti-Marxist credentials Mr Cameron. Show me the money.

despair.

"Thank god I resigned from the Conservative party in 2007 when I thought they were failing to deal with the most important issues, like the economy, whilst peddling far too much of this 'progressive' crap. Every that has subsequently happened has confirmed that my resignation was the correct move. "

I have to agree with your assessment of this "'progressive' crap". 3 & 5 above have some merit the rest seems to be the hangover from Nu-Labour's effective use of PC psycho-babble. I suspect that if the leadership was to lobby the grass roots about their priorities a completely different picture would emerge. These policies will look good in the Guardian. Is that what this is really about, presenting a nice cuddly warm image to the Liberal middle class? "The NHS and international development are the top two Tory spending priorities" I am speechless !

Now I know what Melanie Philips was talking about in The Spectator Coffee House and all I can say is "Gawd help us"

There's more of a consensus here than I imagined. Now will you please. Tim, go tell Cameron that he has half the active people in the party puking in horror at this rubbish. We will vote for him because with Brown still in situ we know our duty but we dislike intensely this lefty do-goody, politically correct half-baked stance. We wouldn't stick with a Tory party if there was a half-good alternative.

"We wouldn't stick with a Tory party if there was a half-good alternative"

CS hits it on the nail: that is exactly the point.

Alternatives available: sacrifice the next election so Labour win, the Conservatives split/implode and a new real conservative party arises; or vote conservative and fight for real Conservatism inside; or vote conservative and say accept real Conservatism is gone for good. (1) is principle; (2) is pragmatism; (3) is defeatism. You choose.


Terry at1603 I think I'll go for (2) because our nation's immediate future is at stake. BUT I'll vote otherwise in the Euros because doing so won't make much difference except wake up the lazy hacks and cause the start of a realignment.

In the locals I shall vote Tory. All the local party people I know and the excellent councillors are utterly p****d off with Cameron - they just get on delivering conservatism locally and very well too.

"whilst peddling far too much of this 'progressive' crap"

Indeed. I kind of thought the whole point about conservatism was the recognition that what we have been "progressing" towards over the last forty or so years has been an unmitigated disaster. I'm not sure how I understand how "progressing" is supposed to be a good thing, any more than "digging" is a good thing when you're stuck in a big hole.

The sad thing, and perhaps even the good thing about many modern politicians is that they reveal their workings and betray their motives.

The irony is that the voting public are like women looking for a husband - they fall in love not with the men who crawl to them supplicating themselves to every perceived whim or demand, they fall in love with those with the courage of their convictions, determination and principles.

That's why the majority loved Thatcher, and those that hated her respected her - because she didn't care about them and she knew what she was about. When I head this guff from Cameron I lose my respect for him. My only faith is in the party loyalists who I hope and pray will bag this stuff up and stick it in the can if the Tories win the next election.

I'm sure Thatcher "progressed" quite a bit Hugh.

Usual comments from the usual suspects, many of whom I suspect would have not been comfortable in the Conservative party under Mrs Thatcher either.

CS, I'll probably vote exactly the same way as you. As an aside, some really good stuff on Laban Tall's blog about Conservatism - basically it is about protecting the principles and policies which societies have shown over the years really work, not unrealistic idealism. A big topic in itself, perhaps one for a platform piece.

Terry suggests 3 options:
sacrifice the next election so Labour win, the Conservatives split/implode and a new real conservative party arises
Not necessarily a bad thing. Could be cathartic, concentrate minds, compel difficult decisions evaded thus far to do with the unsustainability of Welfarism etc.
vote conservative and fight for real Conservatism inside
Been tried more than once. Never works. Vote the present lot into power as is, and they won't give a damn about changing their wet-liberal pragmatist "policies" - why should they, if being wet got them into power...
vote conservative and say accept real Conservatism is gone for good
Contemptible.

"Frankly, if that's your attitude Shaun, I think David Cameron is right to ditch people like you who harp back to the bad old days of the 'Nasty Party' - the 'greed is good' party. You know? the sort of thing that nearly destroyed the Tories in 1997."

Rubbish. The party was bound to fail in 1997-and 2001 and 2005. After 18 long years in power, lets be honest, we got complacent and arrogant. It was time for a change. The media blew up minor 'scandals' out of all proportion (mostly sex scandals I should add which were NEVER anyone else's business anyway and which today would be largely ignored). Furthermore, the party was divided.

But we should NOT have spent the last 12 years beating ourselves up and whipping ourselves through the streets confessing to how 'nasty' we all were. People like Portillo, Bercow, Francis Maude and the like-the betrayers-have done more to damage the party with their constant whinging than the right wing ever did. And I have to say, Theresa May should hang her head in shame for that moment of madness when she succumbed to the trend of the day and referred to 'the nasty party'. We should have held our heads high with pride and talked about the GOOD things we did and the GOOD things we can do again.

The Cameroon's just don't get it do they. Its not THEM that have made the party electable. Its not their political correctness or their left wingnonsense that has made the party electable. The party is electable very much in SPITE of Cameron and his people's best efforts!

"Wouldn't you be happier voting for UKIP or the BNP?"

Well you're obviously left wing if you equate UKIP and the BNP as interchangeable. I would NEVER vote BNP.

"Even I can see that and I'm a floating voter"

Strange then that you say later on that you definately intend to vote SNP then isn't it! And in Stirling too, a seat that the Tories HELD up until 1997 and that we could win again if people like you voted for us!

But here Northern Monkey has betrayed the ridiculousness of the Cameron 'project'. He attacks me for not being 'loyal' to the party, and yet he has made it quite clear that he has NO intention of voting Conservative even with Camerons lurch to the left. I however will be most definately be voting Conservative come the general election in the hopes of something better.

But when I say that in the years to come when the left wing 'fairweather friends' have melted away and the party will once more rely on true Tories like me, that is simply a fact. And if Cameron insists on throwing out everything we stand for in his mission for the Guardian vote (which he won't get anyway) then perhaps he will find that he has destroyed the base of the party when he needs to fall back on it. That is also a fact.

And why Mr Editor are you surprised by the negativity expressed on this site for the issues set out above? Any basic understanding of the party-the real membership, not the Cameroon Club that has taken over the leadership-would leave you in no doubt as to where we stand on these issues.

And when it comes to the question of International aid. I seem to remember that there was a question on this in the last Conservative Home survey. Unless I've missed it, I don't think we've seen the results. What does that show? I suspect that I know and I suspect that the Cameroon Club won't like it very much!

P.S. in addition to my previous comment I should say that I want Cameron to be a really radical Prime Minister that REJECTS the socialist concensus of the day just as the great Lady Thatcher did in the 1980s.

But Cameron seems to think that he can obtain a mass of excitement behind his premiership by offering to PROMOTE the socialist concensus! It is a recipe for disaster and defeat.

Shaun Cameron has stated he doesn;t support the fiscal expansion, he doesnt support the states encroachment and he doesnt support long term state owning of the banks. Doesn't quite relate to socialism to me.

"they make up a large number of the population."

What part of the country do you live in?

OH!PLEASE NOT ANOTHER BUTTERFLY POLITICAL PARTY.NULABOUR HAVE SPENT THEIR TIME IN POWER GOING FOR QUANTITY NOT QUALITY.NOT A DAY PASSES WITHOUT ANOTHER STUPID EDICT.A FACELESS SUITE WHO HAS SPENT THEIR LIVES ON ANOTHER PLANET.PUTS FORWARD ANOTHER HEADLINE GRABBING WHEEZE.IT MAY LOOK WODERFUL ON THE WALL CHARTS PIE CHARTS AND CUSTARD PIE CHARTS.TO JOE PUBLIC IT JUST PROVES HOW DISTANT POLITITIANS ARE FROM REAL LIFE.IN THE MEANTIME THE MINISTER IS PRANCING ABOUT ON TELEVISION OR HEADLINING IN THE NEWSPAPERS.AS THE MEDIA HOLD UP THE HOOPS THEY JUMP THROUGH THEM.WHAT I AM TRYING TO SAY IN MY OWN HUMBLE WAY.IS THAT MR.CAMERON SEEMS TO BE HEADING DOWN THE SAME ROAD.THE PEOPLE OF THIS COUNTRY WANT LEADERSHIP NOT SHOWMANSHIP.

Well I've read all the 5 points, or is it 6 ? Does it really matter ?? !!

Most are from the Harriet Harman handbook and the others I don't really give a damn about.

Jesus wept... now I remember clearly why I started suporting The British National Party.

I can see many potential recruits on this thread. Make the jump, once you've done it the rest is easy.

When the Conservatives ACTUALLY start addressing the important issues you can always come back. But for the time being vote for a party that puts Britain first middle and last. And tells the truth too.

' In a world of deceit, telling the truth becomes a revoloutionary act' - George Orwell.

Please Black day Shouting doesn't get your case across any stronger than plain type.

Now that I have had a chance to read the whole tread I am a little concerned for the Party. Lets not forget that David is talking to the public,his no1 priority is getting us elected as the ruling party. Is it any wonder we have a nasty image when we attack such a liberal set of policies with such venom. We have already either never fallen for the PC gibberish, or we have seen through it. The General public has in many case been well programmed by the PC crowd.
The General public is also dependant and have been encouraged to be excatly that. So they will see us going ballistic because we have more important priorities in mind. The public will think us a very rum bunch of nastiness indeed. So rather than our knee jerk anger at the banality of D.C.'s utterance we need to offer up our suggestions. The NHS as the most obvious manifestation of the One Nation is of course extremely important. Just becuse we promise to support the NHS it doesn't follow that we will want and enforce a very big change in cultural and systemic changes in aims and objectives. The NHS is power and we will want to exercise power, unlike the wimp infested pinko camp, we are unafraid of politicking and unafraid to blatantly take charge. The first place the people really meet the state is at the service points.We will effectively wrestle control from the out going administration by by bureaucrats hello plutocrats it will be an interesting counter revolution. When the big boys with big bag of sweeties choose "not top share" the state has to find a balance our recession is one of necessity from here on in it all down hill if you are honest about our prospects. This recession will be followed by a small upturn before entering a protracted and highly conservative phase in which there will be bugger all growth. The injected money will start to hit the patient soon the recovery will be fleeting and weak.
Many people will simple have to grind against the turn of events. Of course for the plutocrats time is growing closer and for those of us able to adapt the future is very bright. I imagine that in the end almost everyone will be in market. That will be the new golden age of the British after the expulsion and the sanctions against of common law. I want Sunday back by the way, we should not have sold out so quickly to greed.

'Further promotion of women and ethnic minority Conservatives' ?

This is crazy. Candidates should be selected because of ability, not because of the colour of their skin or the content of their knickers.

Labour packed their backbenches with token women, and look at the dismal bunch of substandard jobsworths they ended up with. We should learn from their mistake, not repeat it.

It's also difficult to see how a candidate can command respect if everybody knows that they are only there because of racism or sexism.


"So now we have a green, socially liberal, pro-gay, feminist, anti-Christian Conservative party."

Posted by: Hugh Oxford

Why do you think that the Conservative party is 'anti-Christian' ?

I'd say it's the only party which does have an honest respect for people's religious beliefs.

It is amazing how long this thread has been going. It shows how really anxious people get when they read about such backward looking ideas.

There has to be a major re-think of policy of, among other things, all aspects of the Welfare State. It is totally unsustainable as it is. Who will do it? Us? or a renewed Blairite Labour Party next time round? Because someone will.

Please, Tim, don't dismiss us all as right-wing retrogrades. During the lean years of the Conservative opposition while Blair was strutting the stage, who kept the Conservative party alive up and down the country? WE did.

As has been said above, we will be needed again.

Interesting thread this. Perhaps one of the best comments was from
“A Conservative who happens to be gay” (0747). I wouldn’t agree with his relationship being recognised in law, but he said he wouldn’t be seen ‘dead in a gay pride march”, and doesn’t support legislation that would outlaw 'hate speech' or force equality. So DC has chosen to identify with the most extreme elements in this issue that even many gay people seem uneasy about. Other evidence is that he supported Labour against freedom for the RC adoption agencies. And as others pointed out, going on gay pride marches is an odd priority when true leadership is needed at a time of severe economic difficulty, failure of education, and other services, when most of our laws are due to the EU, terrorist threats…

On the other points on the list of 5, which my first comment (2228 yesterday) didn't really respond to, I'm not keen on some but felt I could live with them. No.4, for example, NHS and international development would be top priorities, not (as the Ed quoted anyway), that current levels of spending would be maintained. As for no.3, the environment, wind farms etc are good but environmental concern must also include things like preserving green space in towns, not building houses in people’s gardens, dealing with local pollution and noise etc. I don't like the positive discrimination implied in no.1. No.5 - the IDS social justice agenda and giving IDS a greater role is worthy of 100% support.

Now let me analyse these 5 points.

Point 1. Further promotion of women and ethnic minority Conservatives.

SJF's Answer. The greatest leader the Conservative Party ever had, Margaret Thatcher, did NOT need any special promotion, she got there on merit! There have also been Black and other Ethnic Minority Candidates, e.g Nirj Deva, who got there on their own abilities. This and all forms of Positive Discrimination, Quotas, Women-Only Lists etc pure Socialism and patronising in the extreme and leave such candidates always open the the taunt, "You only got the seat because you are Female, Black, Asian, etc, etc, etc"

Point 2. Outreach to gay rights groups .

SJF's Answer. This is the worst of all mistakes! What adults do with other adults in private is their affair but although something may be legal that does not make it right to many others. Then again, why give preferential treatment to Homosexuals? there are plenty of other minorities of a Sexual, Religious, Physical, Ethnic, nature. Like many ordinary people I am fed up to my back teeth with the childish attention seeking of the "Gay" Lobby, their "Pride" marches etc. Straight people get on with their lives and do not trumpet their sexual life-style choice to others who do not wish to know about it. To adapt one of that section of the community's own slogans, "So you're Gay? Get over it!". The Conservative Party should potentially appeal to ANYONE on its polices alone and should not pander to any minority of any type. I feel we are making a very big mistake if our Leadership goes down this road and could well pay for it at the Polls.

Point 3. More emphasis on environmental policies. At Spring Forum in Cheltenham Greg Clark MP promised to make Britain the "Saudi Arabia of renewable energy."

SJF's answer. Total tomfoolery, and it was gratifying to read in my local newspaper, the Reading Eventing Post, that many local businesses are ignoring all this Eco-Rubbish as far as they legally can. Customers do not seem to be all that interested in whether they are "Green" or not and with the Economic Depression we are now suffering, businesses do not need this extra cost and hassle. Sorry Zac, perhaps the Green Party can find a place for you. This has lost its sparkle and should be ditched. "Saudi Arabia of renewable energy" where did they find that, in a Christmas Cracker?

Point 4. Cameron-and-NHS. Loud trumpeting of the fact that the NHS and international development are the top two Tory spending priorities.

SJF's answer. NHS yes, a good idea and spikes the guns of those on the Left who feel that the Tories are innately anti NHS. I am totally in favour of revitalising the NHS with more Doctors and Nurses and fewer Managers and Administrators.

International Aid? I can think of many other top priorities and I'm not so sure about it unless it is in BRITISH goods and services and not cash and is tied to us supplying UK made goods etc thus helping our own employment and businesses. Also let us not feed the mouth that bites us in the UN etc. If they are not friends of Britain let them go elsewhere.

Point 5. More initiatives on social justice with a greater role for Iain Duncan Smith.

SJF's answer. Sounds great but is it only a bit of "Mom and Apple Pie"? If Margaret Thatcher was the best leader the Conservative Party has ever had then Iain Duncan-Smith must surely have been the worst! I still blush when I remember his pathetic "Quiet Man" speech at the Conference and it is no wonder that he was not permitted to lead the Party in a General Election. I also recall his appearance in Glasgow Easterhouse, one of the most depressed areas in Britain and I remember that he had plenty of minders. It is a very rough area and I can also remember the occasion when a Tory Canvasser very unwisely went to a die-hard Labour area in another part of Glasgow during the 1970 General Election. He was pulled into a house off the doorstep and stripped down to his underpants then thrown out into the street. Thankfully IDS was spared that ordeal but I feel his presence was equally unwelcome to the local populace and was no more than a gesture. IDS should stand down at the next Election and be given a Peerage, thus freeing up a safe seat, whilst letting him use whatever talents he may have in the Lords.

So all in all just 1/2 out of 5 for these points in my opinion.

The Tory Party should not pretend to be all things to all men, that has been tried once by Blair and New Labour and is a one trick pony. It simply will not work for us. If one wishes to have Moderate Socialism Vote Labour, if you are a Liberal then the Lib-Dem's are for you. You are Green?, then aren't you lucky. The Green party is waiting and ready for your support. We won't win by dressing up in the other Parties' clothes.

I shuddered when I read these Five Points a couple of days ago and various answers on this Forum, with a few honourable traditionalist exceptions, have made me shudder even more. I can see the Tory Party, like the dog in Aesop's Fable, snapping at the larger bone reflected in the water and losing the real bone for its pains.

It would be tragic if, on the glidepath to a Conservative Victory we were to crash and burn as a result of deviating from our proper course.

So let’s get this right. We have Stalin’s nervous breakdown going on in Number 10, the British economy smashed to pieces, world war three about to erupt, courtesy of Pakistan and Iran, the implosion of the taxpayer model of public service, and the institutionalised intimidation and bullying of citizens upholding the values of right and wrong as a result of the dominance of group rights and minority pseudo-‘victim’ culture – and the Tories propose to shimmy around on neo-Marxist and nihilistic rainbow coalition marches as they take us back to a pre-industrial peasant economy, with Iain Duncan Smith tacked on as camouflage for the final disintegration of normative values, common sense and national survival.

A conservative opposition? More like a Weimar cabaret act.

ALL OF OUR POLITICAL CLASS SEEM TO BANG ON ABOUT MODERNISING THIS COUNTRY.PERHAPS THEIR PREACHING TO US LESSER MORTALS WOULD HAVE MORE CREADENCE.IF WE MODERNISED OUR BROKEN DOWN OUT OF DATE VOTING SYSTEM.HOW CAN WE CALL THIS COUNTRY A DEMOCRACY. WHEN A QUARTER OF THE VOTE GAVE THIS GOVERNMENT A MASSIVE MAJORITY.ADD THIS TO THE FACT THAT WE HAVE TO MANY MPs PLUS THEIR BAGGAGE.THE PRESENT SYSTEM PROVES THAT WE PREFER QUANTITY NOT QUALITY.

but there were few problems until they demanded and got rights. Now they are allowed to flaunt their beliefs openly in parades in the hope of attracting youngsters to their way of life

There were problems if you were gay. Until 2003, you could still be convicted of an act of 'gross indecency' if you had sex in a house where others were living. By what right does the out of control leviathan state presume to say what consenting adults may do in their own bedrooms?

And why shouldn't they 'flaunt' their beliefs? I thought that this was supposed to be a free country.

This is the worst of all mistakes! What adults do with other adults in private is their affair but although something may be legal that does not make it right to many others

I feel the same way about Christians; it's legal but I don't like it. But in contrast, I don't object to Christians parading around flaunting their lifestyles at me. It's a big beautiful world out there and there's room in it even for those who believe in sky pixies.

For an apostle of tolerance, the 'Sally Roberts Hammersmith Conservative' attack on Daniel Hannan in the London Evening Standard was quite something.

Shame she didn't reproduce his words to the Americans - don't run your health service like we do - with the reasons. He was commenting on the managerial bureaucracy, not deriding the decent professionals.

Never mind, needlessly show us up as the nasty party, and save your venom for a true Conservative?

Human Zoo? Political lemming, and a bit of an obvious one....

Been thinking about point 2 again. If the Conservative Party has REALLY changed, then you'd expect Lord Tebbit to be accompanying Dave on the gay parade.

The reality is that much of the public will be revulsed by gesture politics. This group have got legal equality, and there is absolutely no public demand for going one step further and maybe being represented by a specifically gay MP (with the same positive discrimination as 'wimmin' MEP candidates?).

This will go down like a lead balloon in the Northern cities where Dave is hoping to make progress. Nor will it necessarily gel with the younger generation (ever heard the common expression 'that's really gay'?).

I don't believe that the state should interfere with people's private lives, but if you go any further than that I believe that you will just be out of step with the majority who are not politically correct.

I just don't get any of this at all:

1. I don't want special promotion of anyone other than honest, ethical and competent people. I don't care if they are male, female, transgender, black, white, brown, yellow or little green men from Mars (so long as they have lived here for a few years). No special promotions please.

2. Enough of special interest groups. The whole country is now a special interest group.

3. "Saudi Arabia of renewable energy." What in the world does that mean. Does he mean that he is going to turn the country into a desert with windmills and banks of photo-electric cells all over the place? What a moronic pledge.

4. We are going to pour more cash down the NHS toilet then! As for international development, what does that mean? Don't you think that we have enough problems at home already that need solutions? What about transport, education, tax, national debt? Stop pouring our money into the leaky bucket that is international development.

5. After 12 years of NuLab, I think we have had enough social justice to last us a lifetime. Why not just repeal every daft law passed by Blair and Brown and leave it at that? Social justice is pretty good in this country, trust me, I have lived abroad for X years and the UK (as I remember it) was a pretty cool place so far as justice was concerned. I think what you are talking about is more PC nonsense.

Raj

If the message has to be interpreted, then it is a very poor message.

I don't want to have to read and re-read things in order to work out what it is they might mean. I want clarity from my political hacks or they can consider my vote as someone elses.

Call me Dave truly has become Blair's Air.

So much drivel. It might well get the 'Nice Party' elected but it won't help run the UK in the best interests of all for the future.

I despair. I'm too old to emigrate and too sensible to vote for the BNP. I suppose the only choice left is not to vote.

What really saddens me is the hopeless future ahead for citizens of the UK in the hands of these public school buffoons.

How low we have sunk when our only choice is Brown or Dave.

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