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12 of the past 13 ToryDiary threads etc... yawn.

I was with you. I really was.

I hope Dave is going to apologise over Ian Oakley....


The posts above say it all really. Enough already!

I really think we've had as much mileage out of this story as we are going to get for now! Time to put it into cold storage to be brought out again at General Election Time....

You had too much mileage as soon as the specific smears were published! Stop drawing attentino to them. That's why Brown isn't drawing the matter to a close -he knows that it is the Tories who are being damaged by this.

Am I the only one who finds it weird that polls never seem to be popping out when Labour are up the creek?

"You had too much mileage as soon as the specific smears were published! Stop drawing attentino to them. That's why Brown isn't drawing the matter to a close -he knows that it is the Tories who are being damaged by this."

Posted by: Dave

Labour trying to smear Osbornes wife harms them and them alone.

I think Sally's right, though. We don't want the electorate to get bored of the story.

But unwelcome images of Osborne and Cameron in the head...as has been pointed out elsewhere -the tactic assumes that people still make the association -no smoke without fire...even if the details are not true it fits with other images/pictures etc. You really really don't want those stories out there. I don't get the feeling that Guido is particularly a friend of the Tories otherwise he would not have published the details -if anything!

40% of the comments probably come from Draper and another 40% from McBride (he has time on his hands to work at them now), I hope the Editor is checking the ISP address to see how many are from Downing Street..You can imagine Gordon screaming as they take so long to update, whacking his keyboard against the desk.

let the articles and comments run, Labour are finished and its fun being a spectator!

This story is good news for us, and frankly the longer it runs the better. It has turned the Labour Party in against itself, demoralised its 'ordinary members' [see LabourList], and even got its press cheerleaders like Ashley and Miles on its back. Genius !

I have just got a gut feeling from the doorstep that the electorate, in England in particular, is going to massacre Labour next time because of issues like this.

"Am I the only one who finds it weird that polls never seem to be popping out when Labour are up the creek?"

It is complete conspiracy - Downing Street has ordered every polling company to cease work immediately and, as they're all Labour lackeys anyway, they obliged immediately.

Either that, or...er...no polling company ever carries out polls over Easter as it inveitably skews the results and produces unreliable data out of kilter with the usual figures.

One of these is true, the other makes you sound ever so slightly paranoid.

This whole affair is so petty and pathetic. I really think they whole "Gordon needs to apologise" thing does more to annoy and alienate voters than to attract them.

Sorry Jonathan, I will rephrase. During Mr. Cameron's leadership campaign a story appeared in several newspapers accompanied by a photograph of George Osborne with a hooker and what SHE said was a line of cocaine. It was alleged at the time that someone was trying to smear Mr. Cameron's campaign and it was alleged that it was another runner.

Daily Mail article.


So it's all about party interest, not the public interest.

Now that the Tory party has milked this for all it's worth, and maybe pursuing it could run counter to party interest, it should be dropped.

Never mind the criminality, the offence against the public as a whole.

Small item of information - something like 99.5% of the public are not members of the Tory party.

Let's drop this now. Let the blogs do their work of keeping the sore well and truly scratched.

This issue is about to "jump the shark".

Well, can I just say that I'm still interested in the story. There are still questions to be answered.

I just don't believe that Brown knew nothing.

What's amazing is the autism of the Labour trolls, they just don't get it. It's just not OK to tell lies about the personal lives of your political opponents. It's just plain WRONG!


No one is saying it is. I was referring to a story in the Daily Mail which wasn't about your opponents, it was about your own party at each other. What do you think of that?

Jamal @ 15:51,

Just for the record (see ConHome passim);

2005. Leadership election. Liam Fox. Gay smear.

Glass houses. This has been a terrible episode for Labour as has damaged them far beyond any ridiculous claims to have hurt the Tories, but the Tories themselves have to be careful claiming the moral high ground.

"What's amazing is the autism of the Labour trolls, they just don't get it. It's just not OK to tell lies about the personal lives of your political opponents."

That's right, Malcolm Dunn, Toryblog.com, Sally Roberts and Cleethorpes Rock are Labour trolls for suggesting the public might get bored with this.


My sentiments exactly. I thought it was a bit rich when George Osborne said "I hope people can see this for what it is... I want to show that politics isn’t like this"

I've just realised my comment ought to be addressed to Enoch above rather than Jamal who on reflection is making a different point. Apologies.

"That's right, Malcolm Dunn, Toryblog.com, Sally Roberts and Cleethorpes Rock are Labour trolls for suggesting the public might get bored with this."

*Sally picks self up off floor in shock*

That is really unfair to Sally. We don't see eye to eye on our politics but she is nothing short of being a Cameron fanatic and loves her party. I think you should retract what you called her.

Hoope your well Sally. Gonna wish me happy birthday by the way? hehe

Thank you joshuwahwah - I think they were joking actually so don't worry though I am touched at you rushing to my defence! ;-)

Happy Birthday and I hope you are celebrating suitably!

No worries and thanks for the best wishes,

I am going out for a good meal with my partner and friends, including some of my Tory friends haha. No doubt they will give me loads of grief for the recent events. But at the end of the day we are friends and our politics don't do anything to ruin that.

If Sally is a Labour troll, I'm a fan of Maggie Thatcher! I've spoke to her on Facebook and she is definately a Conservative and a very nice one too.

All the best, Sally.

You'd have to be headless to believe that Brown knew nothing about it..do me a favour..this is right up his street..this pathetic PM will stop at nothing to prolong this disasterous premiership..that's why he savaged millions of his own by getting rid of the 10p tax band..and why did he do that? He wanted to outwit the Tories..what a horrible man and the sooner this farcical figure is out the better

Sally's a Blue Labour troll! ;-)

Now that all this detente has broken out on ConHome, are we all in agreement (Tory and Labour contributors alike)that the Party needs to stop flogging this particular horse?

Comstock and joshuwahwah, from a Labour point of view, would you prefer that we moved onto other things or that we kept on at this?

Brown knew but we'll never be able to prove it.

I think the momentum is dissipating so it's time to move on. However the whole sordid affair has shown New Lab up for what they really are - scum.

Thanks comstock! All the best to you too.
Chaps I think RichardJ was being ironic so really don't worry - anyway, Cleethorpes Rock is a Conservative activist and Malcolm Dunn a Councillor so I know they're not trolls too. As for our old friend ToryBlog....Ahem! I think we can safely assume he isn't Labour...

"But at the end of the day we are friends and our politics don't do anything to ruin that."

Absolutely right! I have friends of all shades of political opinion but in the end there are far more important things in life! Enjoy your evening.

"Chaps I think RichardJ was being ironic so really don't worry"

Correct, the reason I picked you and the others out is because you are so clearly not trolls! I was responding to someone above who seemed to be suggesting that those who didn't want us to keep banging on about this were Draper's stooges.

I agree Sally.


I will tell you where I am with this. I thnk Mr. Brown should have said sorry in the first few hours of this breaking. That would have calmed it down a little. I think that 'Osborne' is a bit of a hypocrite in asking for an apology when it is alleged that one of his own party attempted to smear him with pictures of him and a prostitute, however and nether the less he deserves an apology.

I think that this episode might come back to haunt David Cameron. He really needs to be so strict with the discipline of his party here on in. Any unfounded allegation against the Labour party, however slight will have the BBC lapping it up and shouting hypocrisy.

The whole thing is bad for politics as a whole. Itis not nice and I was quite appalled.

Cleethorpes Rock, I am not a member of the Labour party, as I've said on here many times.

Thanks, RichardJ! Shows I DO "do irony" ;-)

Boring! Get back to the economy Mr Osborne, what can you do to turn things around after the mess Labour have created?

I was going to ask you if you also did the ironing Sally, but I remember I got told off for a previous sexist post hehe

joshuwahwah, I am afraid we will be told off for going off topic - but for what it's worth NO I can't stand ironing!! ;-)

ahahah Oh god yeah I remember. *coughs* back on topic.........

joshuwahwah, I think you've got that about right.

Sorry Comstock, I should have said "from a non-Tory" point of view.

Yup, back on topic!

I think the last word should really go to GO

"“You have to try and learn to ignore these things. We were enjoying an Easter break with our kids... I hope people can see this for what it is... I want to show that politics isn’t like this.”"

I for one agree with him!

I agree with him too. I think that this was a very sorry affair. But instead of getting involved I would like him to explain what this is all about.

Under secret Tory plans for the NHS, your hospital would be encouraged to take out huge bank loans, and could then go bust if it doesn’t keep up its debt repayments.

Even the Tories say that this “will entail risks to the assets necessary for the provision of essential NHS services”.

David Cameron says that his plans are about giving hospitals “autonomy and accountability”. But what he doesn’t tell people is that, in practice, he believes he can pay for the NHS by encouraging hospitals to borrow money on commercial terms.

At the same time as claiming that he wants to tackle public sector debt, David Cameron wants to abolish the "prudential borrowing code" that currently exists to ensure responsible financial management by NHS Foundation Trusts. The Conservatives have published draft legislation which would allow the NHS to take on unlimited debt – secured against NHS assets such as land, hospital buildings and medical equipment. At the same time, they would prevent the Treasury from stepping in to protect services in the event of financial failure – meaning that all of these assets could be lost to the private sector.

I'm not a labour troll either. Rather, someone who perhaps (perhaps not) has the advantage of sitting both sides of the fence. 1992-95 -Conservative party member and activist. 1997 -did not vote 2001 and 2005 voted Conservative very reluctantly. 2010 will either a. abstain or b. vote Conservative very very very reluctantly or c. if another alternative comes up which is neither left wing nor racist nor single issue will consider them. Have never voted Labour, never will.

What it means though is 1. I know what this sort of thing looks like from the inside -it looks big....2. Have a bit of a feel for what it plays like on the other side -and I've got a nagging feeling that you guys might not be doing so well as you think out of this -at best it's a score draw at the moment but you seem to want to put the ball in your own net!

I don't want you to do that because I'm desperate to see a Government committed to reducing the size of the state, I think Cameron is basically a decent person, think Hague has matured into a good solid politician, like a lot of what people like Fox and Duncan Smith have said, think Redwood's critique of the credit crunch has been very good... Get the message?

Ed, I think you may find that the general public are ever so slightly BORED with this one.

"I really think we've had as much mileage out of this story as we are going to get for now! Time to put it into cold storage to be brought out again at General Election Time...."

Posted by: Sally Roberts | April 15, 2009 at 14:27

Sorry Sally, I must disagree. This is a demonstration of how to-day's Labour party operate. They have to, they don't stand for anything now socialism has gone. Labour means spin, smear and a semi-nationalised media. This must never be forgotten, ever, to-day, at the GE, after the GE and, above all, leading up to the following GE. We may talk of tax or education or Europe in terms of policy, Labour only talk of anything in terms of headlines, spin and ways to smear the Tory policies and the Tories themselves. I suggest they are a bit like Hitler's SS in 1945, everything is going down the drain, hence, no trick is to dirty to try to survive.

"This is a demonstration of how to-day's Labour party operate."

Yes, I agree with you David Sergeant and this is why I suggest putting it into cold storage to be brought out at General Election time. If we keep "flogging a dead horse" now it will backfire on us but some judicial reminding of the public closer to Polling Day may well produce the desired result.

To be honest, whether 'Labour Trolls' or not, the vast majority of the above remarks are misguided to say the least, at the minimum they are introverted and smug beyond belief. When you "A Holes" manage to remove your heads from your nether regions, perhaps a thought you may consider:

Specifically George Osborne's wife was targeted by these 'creatures' and that ultimately was the most disgraceful part of this "exercise" in Gordon Spin.

Cherie Blair seems an odd person but, she chose to lead her own life in parallel with her husband being PM and therefore on her own merits got "snipped at" from time to time, Mrs Osborne is a wife. No, this is not done, whatever the tumult, in politics if not in war, collateral damage is to be avoided deliberately not encouraged and waived away as Brown has done.

Whilst accepting that Brown is by nature a nasty and mean individual, I for one am prepared to accept that in detail if not tone, he was unaware of what McBride was up to. However and whilst apologising to David Cameron and Nadine Whats-her-face is not important, that does not excuse him from apologising and reaching out to a "civilian" in Mrs Osborne who may well be "fragile" for any number of reasons and nothing to do with politics.

Brown made great play that he didn't 'parade' his children for the Media as a dig at Cameron. Now he needs to explain just why "On His Watch", an innocent women has been pilloried by his chosen "creatures" and he sees no reason to apologise most humbly to her ?

No you bunch of....pick your own phrase, this is not 'done' and I'm sorry if you are 'bored' with other people's distress but then perhaps, you like Brown should take a holiday that lasts the rest of your days.

I tended to agree with many of you above and Tony Makara on another thread who said:

"However senior Conservatives allowed this to become another excuse for the Punch and Judy show and the actual gravity of the offense was lost in the sand kicked up by politicos of both sides".

Indeed, I said as much yesterday when I suggested that Cameron and Osborne should up the attack on Gordon Brown on the economy, Andrew Lansley on the NHS (specifically the lack of dentistry and the prevalence of MRSA etc) and Gove on standards in schools, and leave it to the media to deal the McBride saga.

However, reading Alice Miles ('The Brown cabal motto: smears, not ideas') in today's Times has changed my view. She reveals that the media have known all along about Brown's methods, going back to his Treasury days:

"The most lethal attack machine in the history of politics," said one Labour former victim of the No 10 briefers; "they have polluted the core of British politics for years." "Licensed to kill, by Gordon," said another. "Red-on-red action," muttered a third. "These e-mails are the minutest tip of the iceberg. For years and years it has not been the Labour Party's political enemies who have been on the receiving end, it's been people in the Labour Party", as one Tony Blair would no doubt attest.

Just getting rid of McBride and possibly taking out Draper is, as is quoted above,'the minutest tip of the iceberg'.

No 10 has yet to be cleansed and after Jacqui Smith et al's contempt for the electorate, added to the McBride fisaco, Brown is going to be a bear with a very sore head - and very angry.

Yes, I agree with you David Sergeant and this is why I suggest putting it into cold storage to be brought out at General Election time

It'll just be forgotten by then, or they will have done something worse.

This one should be kept going, and then when the next bad thing happens then it will build on it, as opposed to just filling up the cupboard with junk that will never get seen.

That is why the left do well with their 'nasty party' attacks as they never forget and never give in, even when proved wrong.
Remember how picaninnies thing was thrown at Boris last year? ... people remember that but who remembers Damien Green?

A better class of person (than the labourites) would want to drop it, as you do... but nice guys (and gals) finish last!

"When you "A Holes" manage to remove your heads from your nether regions, perhaps a thought you may consider

..that your own blog is so dull, no-one comments on it, so you thought you'd come over here and let off some steam?

Posted by ToryBlog-Not a roon

Glad you have been there and an interesting problem:

The traffic meter is huge, the comments rare so why ? The answer seems to be a combination of things of which the following elements are key:

The individual blogs are not brief enough, they are "essays" rather than standard blogs. Also, and this is my choice, the site is set for my own personal reasons.

There are general 'rules' for commercial sites the first of which, is specialisation in terms of content or direction but this is not intended to be a commercial site, it is my playground for my own purposes and I can both afford to fund it and post regularly.

Next time sonny, try reading the "About" page.

Glad you have been there and an interesting problem

My pleasure. Pleased to double the visitor figure on your huge traffic meter. :-)

When your opponent blows his foot off, don't offer to sow it back on! Labour should be hounded out of office over this. This is just a small example of Brown's psyche.

Dear ToryBlog aka "whitebox re-seller"

No, I understand from the metrics I get, you are unlikely to register individually and as I am sure that you would understand, whatever I'm doing technically is divorced from the content.

However, it is all good fun and I genuinely thank you for your response, have fun, I am.

time you politicians stopped arguing and got on with the job we pay you for instead of acting like school boys.

and a very nice one too

Except when she herself makes personal attacks on the people who disagree with her.

I know I shouldn't be surprised at it any more, but I still am: left-wing people (including the left tendency within the Conservative Party) routinely make offensive and untrue personal attacks on thse who disagree with them, and then are invariably hurt and surprised both at complaints, and at robust responses.

and a very nice one too

Except when she herself makes personal attacks on people who disagree with her.

I know I should be used to it by now, but it still annoys me: those on the left (including, these days, within the Conservative Party itself) routinely make untrue and offensive personal attacks on those who disagree with them, and are then invariably hurt and surprised when people object. Those of us on the receiving end are supposed to be humble and accept our moral and intellectual inferiority with good grace. Well guess what: it's wrong, and those who do it aren't "nice" people.

Before the thread ends, just a reminder of how quickly we forget?

David Cameron approves smear attack on Gordon Brown

By Vincent Moss, Political Editor 22/06/2008
David Cameron has approved an astonishingly personal attack on Gordon Brown in a brutal report on the PM's first year in power.
The dossier peddles unfounded stories that Mr Brown shouted abuse at his secretaries, kicked his desk in a rage, hurled mobile phones and made his former close aide Spencer Livermore burst into tears.
All the stories have been fiercely denied by Downing Street.
Last night, Labour's vice-chairwoman Dawn Butler condemned the "disgusting" personal onslaught on the PM.
She said: "Whatever their politics, I think that most people in this country know that Gordon Brown is a decent man with integrity, trying to do the best for Britain in difficult times.
"I think they will be disgusted by this kind of personal attack."
The Tories will publish their assessment today of Mr Brown's "year of gaffes, tragedy and farce" in a glossy 32-page booklet.
It repeats cruel gossip including an outrageous suggestion that an unnamed cabinet minister had branded the Prime Minister as "basically mental" and "getting worse".
When he became Tory leader in 2005, Mr Cameron vowed to end "Punch and Judy" politics by refusing to insult his rivals.
But his hollow promise was exposed as the Tories unveiled their bile-filled document called: Gordon Brown Annual Report - Do We Want Five More Years of This?
One source close to the PM said: "These are vicious and untrue smears. The Tories are just recycling unfounded gossip."
Among the more bizarre stories is a claim that Mr Brown "stapled his hand in panic" because he was so nervous about the prospect of debating with David Cameron.
It even accuses Mr Brown of "echoing" the British National Party when the PM referred in a speech to "keeping British jobs for British workers".
The dossier uses unflattering pictures of the PM. One sees his eyes shut at a United Nations summit and another shows an orange splodge of make-up on his forehead.
No one at Tory HQ had the courage to put their name to the analysis of the man they brand the "worst Prime Minister in history".
But a senior Tory source admitted: "This was done with David Cameron's full approval."
And the party's top brass insisted on defending the rumour-peddling dossier, being published to undermine the first anniversary on Friday of Mr Brown's arrival at No10.
A spokesman said: "We believe it is a fair assessment of his first year in power. Why should we ignore stories which have been written about him?"

Oh go read Andrew Rawnsley of the Observer in "Servants of the People". This filth and rubbish has been there from the start, and it has got worse. Up your hole you twaddlepuddle , Brown is a good candidate for most vindictive and unprincipled PM of all time.
Wh do you think that the amazement of Labour MPs has been that Brown's cabal have been done for slagging Tories, - why they feel that Brown has spent inordinate resources trying to crush internal differences of opinion.
Yaaaaah, bogoff.
Cameron compared to Rawnsley, 0-5 on listing the deviation from political good manners and principle.

Interesting how some lefties equate some Tory points about Brown, or other matters, which are factual, with THEIR smears, which are wholly invented.

Telling the truth is NOT smearing. Telling lies IS !

Similarly, the Tories are accused of having Bernard Ingham, thus they are trying to justify Damien McBride. Ingham should sue.

Alan Douglas

Alan Douglas mentions Sir Bernard Ingham - and he has previously been alluded to on this subject as Conservative "politicisation" of the Civil Service.
Nothing could be further from the truth. Bernard Ingham was a Labour member in the 60s and 70s, stood in local elections, and could have been a PPC. Instead, he joined the Civil Service and his last master before 1979 was Vis ..... sorry, Tony Benn.
Those to whom Alan and I am alluding (joshutrolltroll, if I recall) are speaking "bunkum and balderdash" - BI's own phrase.

Why do you Labour lackeys not care about the damage this unelected thug has done to the "proud" office of Prime Minister or your party? And before you start with your "You elect a party blah blah" remember Blair said he'd serve a full third term. I voted for him.

David Kelly, Peter Law, Walter Wolfgang, Iraq lies, expenses fraud, high taxes on the poorest - where will it end?

It's always someone elses fault and all Labour governments end in the same way but this is something else.

I'd like to know what that s*it Kevin McGuire knew about all this lot. he's hardly "whiter than white" (you know what I mean Kev...)

This government is an absolute disgrace - what happened to principals?

LORD Hattersley?

"remember Blair said he'd serve a full third term. I voted for him." I am glad he's gone and its difficult to fault that. He was a Catholic in his views and ways I should say.
He trashiest my Country, and through away vast rafts of our freedoms. He was universally wicked in his actions and wonton in his ways. A real implant into our Commons.
Brown being a thoroughly grubby prebbi, has bought into Euro's and attempted to fix the succession to favour Catholics. Oh my how many people don't even recognize the sell out was made? The Unionists of Ireland are the strongest of our folk or kin I should say. We have let them down allowing Labour to carve up their futures. We have been forced by a catholic and by a complacent Brown who should know better than allow that unholy cow Rome dominate the continent let alone this fair England. We are not swallowed up yet Fritz!

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