Boris moves quickly to impose alcohol ban on London's tube and buses

From next month it won't be possible to drink alcoholic drinks on tube trains or London buses.

Boris Johnson issued the following statement to the London Evening Standard:

"I firmly believe that if we drive out so-called minor crime then we will be able to get a firm grip on more serious crime. That's why from 1 June the drinking of alcohol will be banned from the Tube, tram, bus and Docklands Light Railway.  The ban is supported by the Metropolitan Police and British Transport Police, and over the next month Transport for London will make the necessary legal changes and consult with staff."

The policy was welcomed by Don Shenker of Alcohol Concern:

"Public drinking and the behaviour sometimes associated with it can, and does, deeply affect people's ability to enjoy public spaces.  Taking a firm approach to public drinking in this way sends a strong message that public drunkenness is socially unacceptable and will support both the public and transport staff. This, in the end, is what culture change is all about."

Well done Boris!

8th May update: Video of BBC London discussing the ban

Comments

[The Claw]

'Bolris' ???

[Sammy Finn]

It won't be fun policing the ban on the tubes and buses servicing the Emirates, White Hart Lane or Stamford Bridge!

[Alan S]

At long last the law-abiding are going to have the system on their side.
Travelling on the tube at night is horrible sometimes.

[michael mcgough]

Small beer???????????

[Vince]

How very New Labour. This is as illiberal as the smoking ban.

[Simon R]

Bloody brilliant. It's about time people were made to feel safer going about their daily lives. There's places to have a nice relaxing beer -on a busy tube train is not one of them.

I was very vocal against Boris's candidacy. If he keeps making sensible decisions like this one, I will gladly eat humble pie.

[bluepatriot]

Fantastic.

I hadn't even noticed this pledge!

Sceptics of Cameron, Boris etc need to remember that however small the promises in opposition it's always better to be in government because we then start taking all sorts of decisions like this.

[Chad Noble]

"I will gladly eat humble pie"

Not on public transport though if it was cooked with brandy etc... ;-)

Seriously though, surely the ban should be on threatening behaviour etc, whatever the reason,not drinking a low-alcohol ice cold beer on a sweltering summer tube train.

In short, target the law-breakers, not create yet more authoritarian laws to make otherwise responsible people into law-breakers themselves.

[EML]

Not sure whether to welcome this or not - particularly as i'm not from London and so don't travel on London's tubes or buses.

In any event, not very libertarian is it?

[David]

"drinking a low-alcohol ice cold beer on a sweltering summer tube train."

Perhaps you could drink some water instead.

This is an excellent proposal; as a frequent user of public transport, it'll make my later journeys more pleasant.

[Deborah]

It's just a return to good manners.
Well done, Boris.

[Chad Noble]

"Perhaps you could drink some water instead."

Indeed, but now Boris has removed that choice.

Making news laws is never an alternative to policing existing ones! This is so nu-lab it hurts.

[David]

"Indeed, but now Boris has removed that choice."

Tough. It makes things much nicer for the rest of us, and is aimed clearly at encouraging responsible behaviour.

[Chad Noble]

Lol. And to think that Guido is supporting these authoritarians...

We don't like it, so ban it!

[Richard Lowe]

Superb - less than a week into the role and he's delivering on his promises.

It helps its a policy I wholeheartedly agree with.

[David]

No one is banning drinking. Simply that in the case of a shared public space, where an activity has negative effects on others, it is prevented so that everyone can enjoy the public facilities.

Libertarianism does not disregard negative externalities; even JS Mill recognised that.

[Pat]

"surely the ban should be on threatening behaviour etc"

I would have assumed 'threatening behaviour' is already banned.

[LondonLX]

I'm very dissapointed in Boris about this one.
It's worse than the smoking ban as you don't get hurt from passive drinking.
Yeah, you may get hurt by drunks.. but no-one gets drunk on the tube. If you are drinking on the tube, you've got off by the time you're drunk and if you are already drunk, 1 more on the journey is going to make no diff.

Coupled with all the advertising that's going in to promoting this authoritarian policy, I'm sorry to say, this is no better than ken.

How it's going to be enforced, I don't know - not all carriages have CCTV (I hope!)

I hoped this was a policy promise he'd forget about when elected.

[Norm Brainer]

"Simply that in the case of a shared public space, where an activity has negative effects on others"

How can drinking something effect others?
Maybe ban hot food 'cos it stinks, or smoking as it makes the atmosphere unpleasant but do you suddenly die if I add vodka to my bottle of coke? no.

[Alan S]

I hope all carriages do have CCTV. I want potential assailants to know they're being watched.

[Chad Noble]

Where does me quietly drinking an ice cold corona have a negative effect of you, except on your "ooh how awful, alcohol should be consumed behind closed doors so let's ban it" sensitivities?

Regular suffolk commuters will be very used to respectable folk enjoying a glass of wine together on the way home. I've seen few of those old stockbrokers glass a timid conservative.

"I would have assumed 'threatening behaviour' is already banned."
Exactly. The problem is the failure to police existing laws. The solution is not to introduce new ones!

[David (One of many)]

It's actually one of the things Giuliani banned in New York, and it cut down substantially on the amount of oikish behaviour and tramps on the tube network there. No reason why it wouldn't work here, and if you really can't wait your 15-minute tube journey to have a drink, there's something wrong with you.

[Jennifer Wells]

Good but I'm also with Norm Brainer in wanting hot, smelly food banned first. Discarded food often make carriages very inhospitable.

[David]

"How can drinking something effect others?"

Drinking alcohol can, since it leads to aggresive behaviour if taken in excess. This is a transport system, not a place to chill out and knock back some beers.

"Maybe ban hot food 'cos it stinks"

Gets my vote. It's simply all about polite behaviour really.

[Chad Noble]

"since it leads to aggresive behaviour"

So does sexual frustration. Should we also ban people from public transport who haven't knocked one out in the past 4 hours?

[Brenda Jones]

Sorry... sounds a little authoritarian to me.

[James]

"drinking a low-alcohol ice cold beer on a sweltering summer tube train."

I'm not sure where you think you'll get an ice cold beer on a sweltering summer tube train. Most of the drinkers I've seen are quaffing lukewarm cans of lager, leering at other passengers, and as often as not peeing in bits of the train that weren't designed to be peed in.

I am a strongly libertarian Conservative, and I am instinctively opposed to banning things, but as David@1629 said, negative externalities should never be ignored in a blind call for freedom.

The state should be slow to ban, and should only ban that which is necessary (the benefits must outweigh the loss of freedom). When something is banned, it should be properly policed and enforced. If the ban does not have the desired effect, it should be reconsidered.

This seems like a sensible measure, but it must be enforced, and it must be shownb to be effective.

[Paul Oakley]

This is as illiberal as the smoking ban

Hardly. Buses and tubes are not licensed premises. Public transport will not be pushed into insolvency as a consequence of this particular ban in the way that pubs and bars clearly have been as a result of the smoking ban.

[Fred Olsen]

Clearly Boris resting too hard on his 'islamic' roots here.

This is state tyranny at its most annoying. The move won't stop drunk yobs on the tube, but it will stop young law abiding folk who like a beer on what can sometimes be an hour long journey to one's night out location. Result = more binge drinking. Nice one Boris.

[Derek L. Piper]

Paul - very well said! (@16:47) Your point should be stressed over and over.

[James]

In fact, it's probably the case (although I admit I am speculating based on the evidence I've seen personally) that most of those drinking on buses and trains are underage anyway.

It's not uncommon for local councils to enact by-laws banning drinking in public places. This is hardly unprecedented, and I suspect that as many Conservative councils have enacted such a by-law as Labour.

This is devolution of power in action.

[Graham Doll]

Well done Boris, decent folk are fed up with booze-fuelled antisocial behaviour on public transport. I'll shed no tears for those who can't go for an hour without a drink, the poor souls.

[The Silent Majority]

Oh no... here we go again.

We got rid of Ken and we appear to have elected a Nulabour stooge.

If people are being rowdy etc on public transport why not use the existing public order offences to sort it out.

Why ban law abiding citizens from living their lives free of state interference?

Nice one Boris! Another freedom bites the dust.

[Kevin Davis]

Small beer (Sorry) but it indicates he is getting on with the job!

[Fred Olsen]

Devolution of oppression. Again, a failure to understand the young professional class, and high-minded moralism ending in unintended consequences. London is beautiful because of its liberty and respect for the individual. Should that be 'was'?

[Fred Makepeace]

So we are now going to turn law abiding citizens into criminals?

If we can't enforce the current laws how on earth do we enforce this one?

Turn London into a police state?

I starting to read "1984" again. Seems all too familiar.

[Richard]

"No one is banning drinking. Simply that in the case of a shared public space, where an activity has negative effects on others, it is prevented so that everyone can enjoy the public facilities."

If the tubes and busses are privately owned then it's private space and rules on drinking etc should be the decisions of the owners.

"Libertarianism does not disregard negative externalities; even JS Mill recognised that."

Libertarianism deals with externalities via private property rights, as Rothbard confirms.

[Boozers Against Boris]

Bullingdon Boris says that I can't have a can of lager or beer on the Tube home. I regret voting for the authoritarian clown (second preference only thank God).

[Malcolm Dunn]

Good for Boris. If it makes travelling on late night tubes a more pleasant experience than i is at the moment than it's a very small price to pay.

[James Cleverly]

I think that some people on this thread miss the point.

Boris said that he would do this as part of his election manifesto. Now in office he is making good on that commitment.

A Conservative administration proving that we do what we say we are going to do.

Simple.

[Ray]

Why the FUCK would anyone want to drink alcohol on the Tube?

[outraged alcoholic]

since when did people actually drink enough alcohol on the tube to become drunk and aggressive?

surely the problem is people drinking before getting on the tube not when they are on it.

This is a ridiculous idea from a ridiculous politician.

The cameroons are no different from new labour - all show and no substance

[Paul Oakley]

Hmmm. Lots of unfamiliar pseudonyms on-thread tonight. A Kenn-ite version of Der Untergang perhaps. . .

[Miranda]

I'm not sure about banning either. But as so many Londoners see drinking on the tube as a problem, and New York has also used it to 'clean up' I'll go along with it.

Two thoughts come to mind. I was brought up to 'not eat whilst walking the street' as it was not polite - so that is a self-imposed ban. I don't feel its curtailing my freedom, I just feel it's good manners. And if I'm starving I find somewhere appropriate.

Secondly, you could look at it like having sex on the tube, it doesn't hurt onlookers either, but it isn't considered social and is banned. Again, find somewhere more appropriate, or quiet!!

[Norm Brainer]

"outraged alcoholic" ... Exactly!

Unless you're necking from a bottle of vodka, whatever you've drunk on the tube isn't going to affect you while you're still on it in 98% of cases.

Yes, it's true that those swigging from lager cans seem to be the leery ones - but you could also say the leery ones are also the ones wearing trainers and so ban trainers on the tube.

...and if you're playing drinking games on a mostly empty tube as a way to make the journey more bareable, what is there to do instead if you're a trainer wearing type.... torment the passengers? you can be more violent now as you don't have beer to spill!

[Josh]

This is not like the smoking ban because it is not forcing business owners to ban smoking on their own premises even if they don't want to. The Tube is effectively the property of the GLA and so Boris can decide whether or not he wants to allow boozing.

[Richard]

Have just realised in my last post I basicaly said busses and tubes are private property, which of course they are not.

So throw that argument in the can and use this one - drinking booze on the tube doesn't do any harm. Aggressive behaviour does and there are already laws in place to deal with this.

[Patsy Sergeant]

I love all these poor little fellows, and 1 female, who are 'shouting' 'authoritarianism!, after all why should my harmless little drink harm anybody else?'

Well if that is the case, why is a 'harmless' little drink and then driving considered an offence, or illegal if you like???
And 'outraged alcoholic - 17.57 - 'surely the problem is people drinking before getting on to the tube, not when they are on it?' Well yees, and if they are so inclined and drink AGAIN ON the tube they are definitely going to be MORE affected by it. Or are you suggesting that they should be breatherlised BEFORE they get on the train, and only IF they have NOT been drinking then they can go ahead with their self-indulgent booze, as Chad would say lol.

[will.b]

Stupid idea. Why not police yobish behaviour on public transport instead? Aren't those who drink and cause trouble, still going to drink elsewhere and then cause trouble on public transport on their way home?
Is it members of the public who are going to confront people in the same carriage drinking asking them to stop? - more violence there.
Nu Labour style gimmick, get enough police to tackle the anti-social behaviour and leave the rest of us alone!

[Simon Wentworth]

Thank goodness the Tory won the mayoral election, at long last we get some attention to law and order, which Labour shamefully neglected. Cheers Boris, the drinks are on me!

[Norm Brainer]

@"Patsy Sergeant" - It isn't an offence to drink and drive. It's just known as that.
It's an offence to be under the influence of alcohol whist in control of a motor vehicle.
The last time I was on the tube/bus, I wasn't driving!

[Alex Swanson]

I'm as libertarian as anybody, but the fact is, restricting activities regarded as perfectly acceptable in themselves, if there is a public benefit, is well established. If you do feel hot on the tube (and yes, I've done the hour-long tube-and-train London commute) there is always water or a soft drink. If you really can't do without alcohol for that length of time I'd suggest that the law is doing you a service by drawing your attention to the fact.

[AlistairC]

'This is as illiberal as the smoking ban.'

Oh do shut up!

The smoking ban is illiberal as it takes away any choice for people who enjoy smoking as all establishments, even those who's main trade was nicotine delivery (though interestingly some have found a legal way round the law so people can smoke inside, were forced to implement the ban. The Tube is not somewhere that was designed to be used as a bar for people who can't wait a few minutes for there next alcohol fix. This ban is fair and a long time coming.

I for one won't miss the sight of people sat on the tube at 8am drinking Tennents Special while I'm on my way to work.

[Norm Brainer]

"If you really can't do without alcohol for that length of time"
I could "do" without alcohol entirely if I must - But I choose not to!
That's a very lefty excuse for doing something authoritarian; trying to make the opponent look like an addict.

"I for one won't miss the sight of people sat on the tube at 8am drinking Tennents Special while I'm on my way to work."
I don't get what you mean? ..you are just complaining because you think it looks untidy? If they decanted it into coke bottles, would that be better for you?

[will.b]

Alex - there would also be less anti-social behaviour if pubs weren't allowed to sell alcohol - there would be a public benefit.

There is always water or soft drinks. If you can't go out on a Friday night without alcohol I suggest the law is doing you a service by drawing you attention to the fact.

...or should it be freedom of choice and we need police numbers to fight the anti-social behaviour, not more laws because we can't enforce current ones.

[AlistairC]

Untidy? Maybe. Slightly disturbing?Certainly. Anti-social? A lot of people would think so. Tell me Norm do you enjoy the sight of people drinking on the tube? Do you find that it adds 'character' to the place? The Tube is not a pub. If you want a drink go to one of the thousands of establishments in London that sell alcohol. Failing that if you really want to drink while on the move and you feel something would be missing from your life if you can't drink while traveling get a taxi or a maybe a rickshaw.

[Norm Brainer]

Well I'd prefer they were drinking ale from tankards but each to their own.

Do you think drinking should only be allowed in pubs?
At what % alcohol does it become so abhorent to you? - is shandy ok? Can you measure ABV with your eyes to work out how much to get offended?

If you don't like people drinking on the tube then you're stereotyping all drinkers as lager louts - you might as well come out now and say you get worried when you see a muslim with a rucksac on the tube!

[will.b]

Alistair - Will it improve things if the tramp opposite you starts drinking something stronger in a soft drink bottle ?( strangely most use high energy drink bottles )

Next step for Boris will be to give police dip sticks to test if the bottle contains alcohol. So get ready for that if you have alcohol or not.

The alcoholic will of course then down his drink before getting on the tube. Alistair would you feel happier sitting opposite him then.

This ban doesn't help stop alcoholism or anti-social behaviour - it is a first week nu-labour style gimmick. More police please.

[Margaret on the Guillotine]

Ha! It didn't even take a week for the victory to turn to ash in the dogmatists mouths. Proves the new Mayor must be doing something right.

Whenever I go on the Tube in London there are always lairy idiots, necking cans of (usually) Red Stripe, showing no respect for other passengers, being loud and offensive. It's part of the wider malaise of general disrespect and it should be tackled.

I'm not very sorry for those of you who do not now enjoy the theoretical possibility of a drink on the Tube but if truth be told you never used that possibility, did you? Because you realise that drinking on public transport is a bloody rude thing to do. It is those who don't get it that this is aimed at.

Good to see some common sense being enacted from a Tory, rather than arid doctrine.

[Adam-]

Libertarian I am, and I support Boris' right to impose this ban. Buses and tubes are private property. If the owner, TfL, doesn't want people cracking open a can of Stella inside they are well within their right to expect them to leave.

[Norm Brainer]

"showing no respect for other passengers, being loud and offensive."
How is not being able to drink going to stop this? Banning drinks on tube doens't ban the drunks. It's a missing step that people seem to assume like ID cards will reduce terrorism... HOW?

"truth be told you never used that possibility, did you?"
Yes.

"bloody rude thing to do" ... I do offer to share, you know!

I wrote to Boris before he was elected to show my disgust for this policy but still supported him - and also told all my friends too.
...and now I look the fool 'cos next time we're on the way to a club we'll end up drinking everything before we get on the tube and then spend the journey feeling sick - and I'll get the blame for making them vote Boris (and the ken supporters will have a dig too)

But there's also the cost of advertising and enforcing this unnessicary policy - Waste of money.

We pay extra tax on our alcohol to pay for the extra strain it puts on services.

[David Gold]

I welcome this and would also welcome a greater enforcement against drinking in the streets except in specified areas such as at tables outside cafes, specific areas outside pubs, some areas of parks etc? There is nothing worse than sloshed louts leering at people as they try to walk to and from the railway station or after an evening out. It adds to the feeling of being unsafe even when there is no real threat.

[Richard Holloway]

Good stuff Boris, keep 'erm coming!
Bust what I want to know is...When can us motorcyclists use bus lanes?

I know you're working hard Boris, but I'm impatience!

[Richard Holloway]

Good stuff Boris, keep 'erm coming!
But what I want to know is...When can us motorcyclists use bus lanes?

I know you're working hard Boris, but I'm impatience!

[A Drinker (USA)]

Spot on Boris!

If yobbish behavior is fuelled by alcohol, then cutting the alcohol consumed will go a significant way to preventing yobbish behavior!

5p on a pint will not stop the yobs downing 10 pints and getting drunk. The only way to stop them getting drunk is to make it more difficult for them to fill themselves up. I can easily see this cutting the amount of alcohol consumed in a night by 2-4 pints.

Plus, who really wants to drink on the tube or bus or train?

And to all those who say "why just the tube?" This is a good solid FIRST step. I would go further and ban consumption in the streets. And then make sure the pubs & clubs don't irresponsibly aid binge drinking. My best friend is a bartender here in Portland OR. If she serves alcohol to someone visibly drunk, she faces an instant $1000 fine and her bar $5000! So she regularly "cuts people off".

[Richard Calhoun]

A tough one to impose but great credit to Boris for tackling it.

[graeme archer]

Ding-dong: theological libertarians, this is your wake-up call. We just elected a Tory, not a seminar on JS Mill. There's going to be- there has to be- a lot more of this. London's no.2 blight is low-level disorder and a standard of interpersonal incivility which has visibly worsened over the last five years. The no.1 blight is the violent crime which has been fed by the only-just-subterranean aggression we swim through in our public spaces. It's time for decency to re-assert itself. This isn't about turning London into an architectural version of the Daily Mail. It's about re-setting some of the norms of interpersonal behaviour we used to take for granted.

[Norm Brainer]

What I don't get is why people are talking as if the act of drinking is wrong or antisocial in some way.
Yeah, it may lead to that, but life leads to antisocial behaviour. Shall we just lock everyone up in case they fart?

Yeah, we voted in a conservative, but I don't get why free market has to go with non-free lifestyle... and viceversa where Liberals are against free-market.
At least labour aren't a contradiction in terms with restrictive economic and social policies!

[sjm]

"we'll end up drinking everything before we get on the Tube and then spend the journey feeling sick" Norm [email protected].

Well, you've just revealed yourself as pathetically childish in your personal habits, so we can probable dismiss all your comments as being uttered through a haze of ill-considered and juvenile alcohol consumption.

Amazingly, it used to be possible for Londoners to commute to work on the Underground without eating or drinking anything at all during the journeys, and do you know, we survived and mated and gave birth and lived to a decent age despite that appalling deprivation.

In general, I too am against bans, but something drastic needs to be done to stop yobbish behaviour, and I'm willing to accept this as first step back to decent public behaviour.

[Richard]

"Libertarian I am, and I support Boris' right to impose this ban. Buses and tubes are private property. If the owner, TfL, doesn't want people cracking open a can of Stella inside they are well within their right to expect them to leave."

TfL isn't a private body.

[Pamela Goodwin]

And who is going to police this ban?

[Norm Brainer]

"Well, you've just revealed yourself as pathetically childish in your personal habits, so we can probable dismiss all your comments as being uttered through a haze of ill-considered and juvenile alcohol consumption."
And you just now look like a snob who has no care for the way anyone else wants to live their lives and no respect for opinions that don't match yours (or the pope's), and I'll treat your posts accordingly also.

Personally I probably sneak it on and drink gently as I normally do, but I know others that won't.... and you are going to ignore me by association?

Let's ban speaking on the tube too - I've survived tube journeys without saying a word (many people do) .. so why can't we stop those that want to disturb the peace.

"we survived and mated and gave birth and lived to a decent age"
I've never given birth on the tube - maybe we should ban it, just in case.

[Patsy Sergeant]

It seems 'Norm Brainer' has been misnamed, he should be called either 'Norm Alcoholic' (because he certainly sounds like one), or perhaps 'No Brainer!'

[Mark Fulford]

This morning I noticed a sign outside my house that says I live a Drinking Control Area. Mrs F says it’s been there for ages and muttered something about my powers of observation. Now I read about Boris’s new legislation and two unexpected strands come together…

My libertarian instincts rebel against the idea that someone has decided that I can’t drink on my own doorstep -- so much so that I’m tempted to go there and get blind drunk, right now. But rationally I see that the liberty I have lost is one that I had never previously exercised. The liberty that I have gained, to sleep peacefully without being woken by drunks pissing against my wall, is one that I had previously lost -- with far less say in the matter. Clearly it would be better if none of this were necessary, but that’s not the crowded world where we live. Thank you to whoever took the trouble to make my street a little more pleasant. I'll go and toast you, right now.

Boris’s new alcohol restrictions on London Transport are little different. Chad’s loss of liberty to drown his UKIP sorrows on the buses (btw, you can still drink in taxis) is our freedom to travel safer and more pleasantly. Thank you Boris.

[Norm Brainer]

" The liberty that I have gained, to sleep peacefully without being woken by drunks pissing against my wall, "
How does stopping drinking on the street mean that drunks no longer pass your house?

@"Patsy Sergeant" - as I mentionned earlier in the thread. Calling people names isn't the way to win an argument.

[Rob]

I'm very glad that Boris has made quick progress on this policy pledge following a million Londoners voting for him and his plans last week.

Steps to help public transport become more civilised are very welcome. There are no toilets on tube trains and they can be quite claustrophobic at the best of times. It's unavoidable that you will still get drunks on the underground but I can see no justification for allowing them to become even more drunk during their journey.

[will.b]

My objection to this is not particularly libertarian, but just that it is not workable. We have tried similar in my own area - it is a gimmick that moves the problem around.

Who is going to enforce this - members of the public, transport staff? Does the bus driver have to stop the bus and wait for the police? Is this going cause less violence or more?

Again more police targeted on the yobs causing trouble will cut anti-social behaviour. Use current laws not make another new law that can't be enforced.

[Edison Smith]

I've always wondered why people try to rehydrate themselves on hot days by drinking alcohol.

It doesn't work. Alcohol dehydrates you, which is why you feel you need to drink more when you have it.

If you're hot and thirsty, drink water like civilised people.

It's cheaper,and better for your liver.

I find people necking cans of Heineken on Tubes is intimidating. And I'm not elderly or infirm. British people cannot act sensibly around drink so the drink must be removed, like the rattle from the toddler who can't play nicely.

Nanny state? No, just - as already mentioned - a return to common decency.

[Mark Fulford]

How does stopping drinking on the street mean that drunks no longer pass your house?

You are revealing your limited understanding of the issue. The problem wasn’t drunks passing, it was drunks staying put.

[will.b]

Edison - I agree but -

http://www.channel4.com/news/articles/general/water_cooler_moments/beer%20helps%20athletes%20rehydrate/993172

:-)

[will.b]

I agreed at least with first bit.

"British people cannot act sensibly around drink so the drink must be removed, like the rattle from the toddler who can't play nicely."

So are we going for prohibition and this is the first step?

[Londoner]

1. It was an election pledge, quite prominently put forward in several broadcast hustings. Redeeming a pledge on Day 2 in the office isn't bad.

2. It is not anti-libertarian. You don't have to travel by a TFL vehicle. Just as a taxi driver can refuse to pick up a fare with a beer can in his hand, and probably usually does.

3. I would however be against a general move against "consuming alcohol in public". It is not a shameful thing in itself and I can see nothing wrong with beer with a picnic in the park, or drinking champagne on the banks of the Thames on Boat Race day. Some parks outside London do ban alcohol and it's very silly - I know as my son was almost arrested when drinking a bottle of wine with his girlfriend to celebrate the end of his University exams. But Boris did not pledge to ban all alcohol in public and, as a fully paid up cavalier, I very much doubt he would go down that route. The right to swig alcohol on the tube or bus is frankly something that only an alcoholic, or someone already drunk, is at all likely to want to do. In both cases you are doing them a favour by not allowing it.

[Andy Peterkin]

Thank Christ for this - idiots like Noble who clearly rarely ride the Tube late and night obviously have no idea how intimidating the booze-swilling hoodies are.

[Chad Noble]

"Chad’s loss of liberty to drown his UKIP sorrows on the buses (btw, you can still drink in taxis)"

LoL. They do have lots of sorrows, I agree Mark, but I'm not a ukipper.

Still, I look forward to this unworkable and bonkers boris (or bonkers Boles?) idea being introduced next month to see how many minutes it takes before descending into farce.

[Mark Fulford]

They do have lots of sorrows, I agree Mark, but I'm not a ukipper.

Sorry, I find it hard to keep up ;-)

[Chad Noble]

Good job I haven't been tempted by the Devil's Kitchen joke 'libertarian party' too! ;-)

[Norm Brainer]

"British people cannot act sensibly around drink so the drink must be removed, like the rattle from the toddler who can't play nicely.

Nanny state? "

Um... have you not just defined nanny state in your paragraph above.

"You are revealing your limited understanding of the issue. The problem wasn’t drunks passing, it was drunks staying put."
Ah.. well in that case a no-drink zone makes some sense as it stops the loitering.
I don't know people who go on the tube specifically to drink!

"I find people necking cans of Heineken on Tubes is intimidating"
There are many things that many people find intimidating.. like if I wander around in my biker jacket.
Should that be banned too?

All the examples people use seem to refer to lager... is the problem with the drink or the people who drink it? Is this a class war in disguise because only poor people would drink the putrid stuff?
Wouldn't mind if you banned lager(everywhere) as I do think there's something different about the ones we get here that makes people more violent.

In any case, as I originally stated: This policy would make little difference as the amount drunk on the tube is unlikely to have any effect until after they get off, and for this we have to pay for all the advertising and enforcement.

http://up2.it/nbrainer/tramp.jpg

[Fred Makepeace]

OK Boris you have already upset Guido Fawkes with your first policy announcement. Is the tide turning already?

"The First Days of Mayor Boris

It got off to a good start with the police making good on his tough crime stance promise - shooting a drunk gun toting lawyer. However this banning of drink on public transport* has Guido worried (for one reason and another). Will hip-flasks be confiscated?

Will we be able to travel intoxicated, will one be able travel with bottles of booze? What are the mechanics of this? Guido may have to resort to Cameroon style transport arrangements in London - cycling one-handed while swigging from a jug of Pimms. Oh, hold on...

The thing is Boris, if you go to Beijing to hob-nob with Tibet's oppressors (and don't send the right signals) as well as getting all authoritarian in your first week with the G&T swilling classes on the long march to Zone 6, we will remember your treachery come 2012. This may be the most rapid disillusionment with a politician ever...

*Pretty sure that Guido was served alcohol on public river transport between Westminster and Canary Wharf one evening. It was pretty civilised for public transport. Is that to be banned?

[Chad Noble]

Thanks Fred, I wondered how comfortable Guido would be supporting this new law.

Well done Guido.

The question is, will this policy end in farce or tragedy as someone seeks to take this bonkers boris law into their own hands and stop someone quaffing some ale...

[Gerard Charmley]

Good for Boris! The sooner alcohol is recognised for the blight it is, the better. After my unsuccessful attempt to become the first Conservative Councillor for the Ely Housing estate in Cardiff, I spent Monday night in casualty after a cycling accident that has sadly rendered past images of myself obsolete. Most of the people there were there because of drinking, and the poor staff of the unit were rushed off their feet, as well as being treated badly by people who were far too drunk to know what they were doing. Apparently, it is the same every weekend or holiday period. If an invading army or a gang of criminals were causing damage on this scale, then a state of emergency would be declared. Every little helps, and Boris' move to stop drinking on public transport in London is a long overdue step in the right direction.

[StevenAdams]

I'm sorry, but some of this debate is just hilarious. The main thrust of his election campagn was to crack down on yobbish behaviour on London'd transport network. Drinking on it is one logical strand.

I grant you that the odd harmless reveller may have to wait 20 minutes before drinking their harmless post-work come down but that is a reasonable price to pay for the reduction in shouting, partying yobs that I often have to endure on the way into London as they get 'power-pissed' to make their club night 'better'.

A sensible action that abides by conservative focus on law and order.

[passing leftie]

I think the problem with drink on the Tube is that most of it inside passengers, not in containers.

[Jonathan Campbell]

How very nu-labour of Boris, disorderly conduct could have been and should have been dealt with under existing laws.

Makes me wonder about what sort of government we'll get after 2010..