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David Cameron and other politicians has to understand the sense of alienation that draws young muslims into militant islam. These young men see a liberal society that is based on materialism, a lack of spirituality and built on wanton excess. They feel they cannot belong to this society and at times I feel alienated from it too. This is not making excuses for terrorism but rather trying to understand the root cause of the problem.

As I've stated before in these forums I believe the west has become morally degenerate over the last thirty years or so and that does exclude those who want to live a more upright lifestyle, be they muslims, christians or jews. Only recently on Americas ABC TV I saw a jewish rabbi condeming the sick 'Bodies' exhibition, one in which corpses are displayed for artistic effect. The things that repulse us about western society ought to be the things that can unite muslims, jews and christians.

Sorry Tony, you are making excuses. Islamist terrorists are only concerned in killing us. If they do talk of anything it is for us to do as they say or get blown up, full stop, period. You clearly are unhappy at many trends in modern life (here here) but the idea you can achieve anything by killing people is absurd so how can you excuse a young muslim?

Hamas, of course, refuses to recognise Israel - not much Israel can do but fight them. But this does show you one way terrorists work, there was dialogue between Israel and Palastine, so Hamas send rockets in to Israel forcing Israel to respond - end of talks which is what Hamas wants. The IRA used to pull this sort of trick when talking might start. My point is that they rely on people to look for excuses so they can create a situation where peaceful talk can't happen. Being nice and considerate is meat and drink to terrorists.

David Sergeant, yes, I agree that when they have reached the level of terrorist there probably isn't much chance of changing theit mindset. However a terrorist doesn't become a terrorist overnight and there must be a process that these young men go through that slowly leads to radicalization, a point at which they give up on integration and turn their fire on society. My argument is that we need to understand what is so bad about British society that drives these young men into the culture of terrorism.

When one reads a speech like this one is reminded of why we are always better off with a Conservative government.

This is odd. Last year after staying with a Muslim family he said that it would be better if Britons adopted British Asian values.
One hopes that those who followed his advice do not feel they have been wasting their time.

This problem would be a lot easier to tackle if we didn't have ZanuLabour and their left-wing 'academic' sympathisers acting like terrorists are somehow morally superior to Britain. The sooner the state sees that multiculturalism is a failure and only fosters the resentment it was intended to eradicate, the better.

David Sergeant - yes I agree; I am afraid Tony is making excuses! As for saying the West is "morally degenerate" - I am deeply uncomfortable with seeing women on the streets not only wearing hijab but also niqab or even burka and feeling that they are somehow judging me and finding me wanting! I dress modestly and live a reasonably decent life. I do not want to feel that I am somehow being bracketed with binge-drinkers, teenage single mums and drug takers!!

Tony, young men slowly become radicalized firstly because they are told, by Labour usually, that their poor position in life is not their fault but "society's". Labour and the left have made a living out of telling anyone with a beef this. Secondly they notice that being radical can pay off - beats working for a living - mostly because nice people try to sympathise with them.

Sally Roberts, when I say the west is morally degenerate I am not referring to ordinary people by rather to the movers and shakers who run the media and promote inverted values. Magazines that promote female celebrities who are no better than glorified whores while at the same time political commentators berate and abuse hard-pressed single mothers who are struggling to bring up children alone. Television programmes that trivialize and glorfy drug-taking and excess while our young people are suffering the misery of drug addiction and death by overdose because they can't take this world anymore. This is a sick society and I'm not surprised that young muslims look for something higher, something to take them away from the crass materialism of 21st century life. I don't support or want to condone terrorism but I understand why people feel angry and want to fight against something.

Hizb ut Tahrir - why does Cameron keep giving this pitiful group the oxygen of publicity? If he really wanted to destroy them he'd invite them over to tea at CCHQ. And if Cameron wants to affect an interest in other people's problems (ie, Israel's), he might do well to read the excellent article in this month's Vanity Fair on the Hamas Gaza coup.

Tony Makara makes a fair point. I don't think he is at all in favour of the redical Islamists/terrorists, but he essentially makes the valid point that, quite apart from their terrorism, much of the value system promoted in this country via the media or vis government policy is immoral. You can't blame traditionally minded Muslims for turning away from a society that promotes these things. We are really lacking the third leg of the traditional Tory stool, namely traditional values, Take these out and you just have economic/social liberalism plus standing up for the nation - not enough without the third leg, which gives the moral vision for the culture.

Tony - you're at it again!!!

Ben Rogers, yes, we've got to get politicians thinking about why terrorism occurs as well as thinking about how to deal with it. Something is driving young muslim men into taking onboard this radical lifestyle and I believe it is a reaction to and a rejection of decadent aspects of the western lifestyle.

If the mossad will go to Britian and kill Mousawi I wouldn't loose any sleep over that!

The root cause of Islamic terrorism is Islam. The basic Islamic upbringing is stage 1 of the grooming process. All you have to do is read the Koran which is full of hate, intolerance and incitement to fight and kill.

The Koran and ahadith state that Islam is to rule the world, even though people may dislike it. The Koran and ahadith state that Muslims must fight until all religion is for Allah.

I do not like being termed "najis" - impure, unclean and best avoided. These are the things that Islam teaches the Muslims and manipulates their attitudes towards non-Muslims.

Islam prevents integration and no matter how many Faith Cohesions meetings are held the integration matter stops with a judder at the buffers of the Koran and ahadith.

It is my view that Islam should be put under full public scrutiny in the media so that everyone fully understands the implications of Islam for the non-Muslim secular society.

P Fletcher

Good for David Cameron. And, Tony Makara, it is not our fault that young Muslims turn to terrorism. It is the fault of an Islamist ideology, Islamist leaders who manufacture grievances and a victimhood mentality in order to gain power and push their own totalitarian and illiberal agenda and our failure to be much much more robust about our standards, culture, freedoms and what we will and, above all, will not tolerate. I am not going to be lectured on decadence by a community which, in large part, comes from a backward, peasant community which has little understanding of secular values or liberal democracy and which follows a religion which, in large parts of the world - not all, is intolerant and barbaric in its attitudes and practices. We should be much more open about standing up for our values, about why we believe them to be better and about what is and is not acceptable in our country. Such steps should include: (1) reversing the Government's decision to allow polygamous marriages in this country - an example of multiculturalism taken to absurd and offensive (to us) lengths. (2) A clear statement that Sharia law will never be permitted in the UK and that if people want to live under Sharia law, they should move to countries where it is the law. All citizens, whatever their religion, are equally subject to British law. (3) A statement that minorities have the right to practise their religion but where they seek to do so in a way which impinges on the majority their rights will necessarily have to be limited: so, for instance, no calls to prayer in Oxford or anywhere else. (4) Clearly stating that where minorities' so-called cultural practices conflict with the laws of the land, the latter take priority. So no "forced marriages" or rape as it's known here, no "honour killings" or murder etc. Let them be called by what they are not by euphemisms and let the law be rigorously applied to such crimes. All those who participate in these appalling practices should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. Indeed, I would favour making "honour killings" a specific offence, precisely because of the signal it sends out that we will not tolerate the intolerable whatever cultural pieties we hear from so-called community leaders. We should also be much more vigorous in prosecuting those families who take their under-age daughters out of school and deny them an education or force them into marriage abroad, as reported in today's papers. (5) No more Islamic faith schools until we can be confident - as we are not now - that they are not being used to indoctrinate the young with anti-British/anti-democratic views and beliefs. (6) Much tougher action against those mosques, mosque and other so-called Islamic bookshops, preachers, imams, community leaders who preach hate, anti-Semitic, anti-Christian views. Challenge the anti-Semitism/anti-Christianity all too widespread amongst the Muslim community. These bodies should be monitored and those preaching sedition and hatred deported or prosecuted. If necessary, close mosques down where they are being used for seditious political purposes rather than as places of prayer and worship. We must state clearly that there is a treasonous group within the Muslim community and that we have to take whatever steps are needed to root it - and its pernicious views - out. We have waited in vain for Muslims themselves to do this. Since they won't or can't we have to do it. (7) Ban all foreign funding of Islamic mosques, schools, charities etc. This is critical: it is one of the ways the fundamentalist Wahabi sect in Islam gets its hold over Muslim communities in the UK and this sect is closely linked to the Islamist terrorist ideology. He who pays the piper calls the tune and this is not a tune we want sung in our country (8) Refuse to deal with the MCB and other so-called community leaders. We need to encourage genuinely moderate Muslim leaders not appease self-appointed ones with an agenda which is hostile to our interests. Make it as unacceptable to deal with extremist Muslim groups as it would be to deal with the BNP. When so-called Islamist leaders criticise some aspect of our policies, challenge them: ask them why young Muslims aren't working in Palestinian charities rather than blowing themselves up if they're so concerned about the Palestinians. Ask them to criticise the persecution of Christians in Muslim countries. We have been far too ready to have a debate on Islamists' terms rather than on ours. Islamic societies are largely failed ones, Western ones aren't - that is why the flow of Muslim immigrants is to the West - and we should not be shy in stating this obvious fact. (9) Tell Muslims that as British citizens they are expected to abide by British law in full and they have both the rights and responsibilities of British citizens. If they feel a greater allegiance to some other state, country, system of law or whatever, then they need to make the obvious choice. What we cannot have is a community here which seeks to enjoy our advantanges and freedoms while undermining - in a host of ways - the very way of life which underpins those same advantages/freedoms. (10) So take active steps to encourage integration: no burqas, reintroduce the primary purpose rule for marriages from the Indian sub-continent, stop the over-sensitivity to Muslim complaints / sensitivities, stop appeasing every demand. As a Catholic I don't expect my employer to provide me with an in-house chapel. Why should Muslims be given special prayer rooms? And to those who will inevitably say that I'm picking on Muslims and why not do the same to Hindus, Sikhs etc? Well the answer is that it is not those communities who are demanding special privileges and sympathising with and producing terrorists, suicide bombers and the like. It is from Islamic fundamentalists and radicals (and I fear not just them) that the risk comes and that is where the action needs to be directed. If Muslims do not like being associated with terrorists, then they need to do something about it. So far, there has been - largely - silence from them. We need to be proud of our country and determined to take action against those who are hostile to it and to those who appease those same forces.

I agree with everything that C Powell says with one qualification. There is no such thing as a moderate Muslim. All true Muslims must fight until all religion is for Allah. Their aims are the same as the extremists only they differ in how to go about it.

Some prefer direct action which is sanctioned in the Koran and ahadith while others prefer the demographic approach such as outbreeding the indigenous population and marrying outside Britain and then importing their spouses.

Lord Sheikh of the Conservative Muslim Forum wants more Muslims in politics to exert their Islamic influence on British policy at home and abroad. He thinks that pro rata there should be about thirty-five Muslims in Parliament and is schooling prospective Muslim candidates. He is not suggesting which party the Muslim candidates should represent as it will not matter as they will vote for what suits Islam best. Read his speeches.

P Fletcher

It makes me very angry when muslims challenge attitudes in the west.

We KNOW that their religion (so called) wants to dominate us all, trample on Christianity and denies the deity of Jesus.

We know they want sharia to rule us.

We know there are muslim mp's with an "Islam agenda".....but we have to make up "excuses" when we are asked "Why dont make way for Islam"?

We know they will never integrate (if they indeed ARE muslim)for Islam doesnt allow it!

What the hell are we doing???? We are making huge rods with which Muslims can beat us.... the west and Islam just will never be compatible ..its a square peg and round hole....... by God...Davids got guts to want to be pm !!

And it would be nice if we had an Archbishop of Canterbury who defended traditional Christian morality rather than supporting the introduction of Sharia law.

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