Marland criticises the critics

Lord Marland, who was Conservative Party Treasurer until six months ago, has been interviewed by the Telegraph about the party's progress:

"David Cameron was elected on a change agenda, a change of emphasis, a change of strategy and a change of direction of the party. Turbulence happens in politics. It happened to Thatcher, it happened to Major, it happened to Churchill. It is the strength of the politician when they come out the other side. Don't forget that David had been ahead in the polls 18 months ago."

He goes on to dismiss criticisms from former donors Lord Kalms and Sir Tom Cowie, particularly that the party is run by arrogant Old Etonians, and says that there is too much press focus on the motives of big donors.

Also in the news today, the Times Business section reports that Marland and the billionaire Reuben brothers may make a joint $3bn bid for the Orient Express hotel group.

Deputy Editor

Comments

[Caroline Best]

I wish people wouldn't spout on about how Cameron was elected on a 'change agenda' and therefore we all support it. Maybe some people voted for this, but I guess most voted for a personable young man who looked good on TV and had a bit of charisma (which unfortunately David Davis did not).

[Sally Roberts]

Marland speaks with a lot of wisdom here and I believe he's always been one of the more sensible people in the Party. We could do a lot worse than listen to him rather than rush headlong into a bout of "headless chicken-itis"!

[Traditional Tory]

Let's take a look at this so-called 'change agenda'. Cameron overruled party democracy and imposed the A list, with its smattering of black millionaires. The gays were there anyway, so that wasn't really a change at all.

Then came the touchy-feely hot air and BS from 'Hug a Hoodie' to 'Hug a Hutu', all of which bombed with the public.

Don't let's forget the reports from the various commissions, but most of these have simply recommended traditional Tory policies - hence the media accuations of a 'lurch to the right'.

No change on the EPP of course, but we should never forget that in one respect Cameron has successfully thrown the gears into reverse and put a bunch of Old Etonians and equivalents in change of what had successfully become the party of 'Middle England'

That's about it. Ah no, don't forget the ludicrous tree logo. During the week a CCHQ apparatchik was quited as stating it may 'change with the seasons'

What an entertaining concept. May I suggest perpetual nuclear winter for the remainder of Dave's unfortunate reign?

[Umbrella man]

I agree with Caroline.

Cameron also stood on a promise to leave the EPP and that didn't happen.

He promised to make the party more representative but merely traded white male barristers for white female bankers.

[Jones]

stop whining and get behind DC...

[Umbrella man]

With a knife, Jones? That's the usual Tory way.

[Justin Hinchcliffe]

Traditional Tory - you're a coward or a troll (or both!). I suspect you’d be happier with the BNP, rather than a mainstream political party.

[simon]

Should we not rename the party more in tune with our leader's decision making prowess? Something appropriate...How about 'Eton Mess'! I jest of course...

[Traditional Tory]

With a knife, Jones? That's the usual Tory way.

Not the way of ordinary activists, Umbrella Man, but sadly it IS the way of the parliamentary party, as Thatcher and IDS could testify (together with Major, although he richly deserved his fate).

By getting our before they were pushed Hague and Howard proved the point even more eloquently.

Roy Hattersley once branded the Tories 'a cruel party' for this very reason. He was right. Sadly, more even than MPs of other parties, our parliamentarians are primarily interested in their own political skins... and their salaries.

Before long 'Dave' will feel that knife between his shoulderblades.

[Hmmmm]

Lord Marland was the Tory equivalent of Lord Levy, i.e. chief fundraiser. Does anyone know how many Tory donors received honours, especially knighthoods or peerages, whilst he was Treasurer? Of course, he got one himself....

[Editor]

Traditional Tory may not have views to your liking Justin but let's be more careful with the BNP attacks please.

[Felixstowe fiddler]

But David is not ahead in the polls now. And that's the point - the party only prospered as Blair became more and more discredited and loathed. He's gone, Brown's done well, the Tories appear to be imploding along with the Lib Dems, and Labour will will a fourth term. If the next election results in a Labour landslide approaching an overall majority of 200 (winning seats like Bury St Edmunds which they narrowly failed to do in 1997), then Brown will already have won the subsequent election and Douglas Alexander - aye, another wee Scot - probably the one after that.
What a shambles.

[Logos]

change to win people, Brown is currently determined to portray the party as lurching to the right, imagine how easy that would be if Davis or Fox and won the election.

Sorry but politics is now about the centre ground, I agree that there are wrong ways to go about it capturing it but TT criticises the hug a hoodie agenda, I assume he is from the US 'prison works' brigade. look around you, it clearly doesn't

[Editor]

I'm not convinced Logos that a p[olitician being on the centre ground is really what concerns voters. They certainly don't want people who are extreme but i do not believe that supporting marriage or controlling immigration are extreme. I suspect most voters are interested in whether politicians are strong and good leaders - more than whether they stand in the centre. Was Mrs T ever thought to be a politician of the centre?

[Ben Redsell]

Tim, you can't surely be arguing that what the public want is a leader NOT from the Centre? Oh, then again maybe you can. After all they voted for Major against left wing Kinnock, they decided Maggie was closer to the centre than Foot, they voted for Blair against a number of right wing Tories...

Felixstowe Fiddler, don't be silly. This is an expected Brown Bounce and was widely predicted all over the place. What hasn't been widely reported is the differing likelihood to vote, that Brown is not as able to get his people out as Cameron is - interesting that people who want to be an ideologically pure opposition forget that. We aren't going to be losing seats like Bury St Edmunds, we'll be winning those like Waveney and Ipswich.

[Hmmmm]

Ben Redsell wrote "we aren't going to be losing seats like Bury St Edmunds". David "treat me" Ruffley's majority in 1997 was only 368!!

[Traditional Tory]

Traditional Tory - you're a coward or a troll (or both!). I suspect you’d be happier with the BNP, rather than a mainstream political party.

Care to answer the charges rather than slinging insults, Justin?

Next time I'm reading my eagerly-awaited personal copy of 'Spearhead' I'll checkout BNP policy on telling the unemployed to go fish for their dinners.

Or could that be too extreme for them?

[Felixstowe fiddler]

If Ben Redsell thinks that an October election will result in Tory gains in Ipswich and Waveney, then it just shows what a dire state this party is in. You are totally out of touch with reality. I agree there is a Brown bounce - but it's been combined with a dismal Tory performance since the end of May, a lack of policy substance, and - more importantly - voter relief that Blair is gone and puzzlement over the Tory leader wanting to ape Blair.
After defeat in 1997, activists were going around the conference in Blackpool saying. "It's just an aberration - when voters wake up and see what they've got, they'll come flocking back. We won't need even to go on the knocker."
How wrong they were - and how wrong you are now Ben. Just as you were wrong when, as part of the Tory administration in Suffolk, who were convinced a Labour government would not give Ipswich unitary status (sorry to be parochial).

[Ben Redsell]

Hmmm and what is David's majority now? Sorry, how many Labour councillors are there in Suffolk now? Who runs the County and Borough council's in Bury?

Don't be a fool. We won't be losing seats like Bury St Edmunds and that isn't complacency it's down to a lot of hard work by the team at BSECA.

[Traditional Tory]

If Ben Redsell thinks that an October election will result in Tory gains in Ipswich and Waveney

Talking about 'out of touch' did anybody read Selwyn Gummer's pro-Cameron Telegraph article in which he claimed that certain wards in Ipswich were among the most deprived in the country.

Having once worked in Tower Hamlets I found that very difficult to believe and when I put it to a woman who lives in Ipswich she tld me it was utter nonsense.

It seems the 'Roons and the remaining Heathmen are uniting in their de haut en bas ivory tower.

No surprise there.

[Buckers]

Every General Election in living memory has been won on what the public percieve as the centre ground - or it has been won by the party closest to this centre.

In reply to the Editor, its a bit of straw man to suggest that Margaret Thatcher won the election from the right- she still appealed to the centre ground because she was up against an old Labour Party situated on the far left. Furthermore, its worth remembering that before office, Margaret Thatcher was percieved by both right and left to be totally ideologically vacant (sound familiar?).

[Justin Hinchcliffe]

Traditional Tory - care to reveal yourself? What really pisses me off is that I work my butt off for the Party (tomorrow I shall be leading a team of 15 deliverers in 'safe' Tottenham in a bid to get rid of the Socialists) only to come here, find people who claim to be Tory and read highly anti-Tory posts. People who consistently whinge on this blog have probably never delivered a leaflet in their life, especially a Tory one! So you don't like Cameron? Fine! But why feel the need to blurt out your anti-Cameron crap day in and day out? Get a life! You're morons. And boring ones at that!Go play with the trains!

[Ben Redsell]

FF I don't think there will be an October election, simply because the Labour party have an obsession with combining elections to try and maximise their advantage. I do believe it might be in Spring 08 and I do believe that Peter Aldous will win in Waveney, where we now run the council and have a much better organisation than we did even in 05. Ipswich will, as you know, be a lot harder. However Chris Mole is a nobody locally, we simply need to improve our structural organisation to ensure that our GOTV campaign is a lot better, and choosing a good candidate on Thursday night will be vital to this.

I don't believe the party is in a dire state. I agree there are places where improvements can be made, and mutual aid is one of them. However where we get things right, the last election showed we can win.

In terms of policy, just because the Mail and the Telegraph don't publicise it doesn't mean we don't have policies! It might suit Paul Dacre and Simon Heffer to damage the party at the moment, but don't believe the headlines.

After all you only have to look at the Social Justice report or the Economic Competiveness report to understand that. For all DCs so called touchy feely stuff, the basic policies that are coming out are based on Conservative ideas developed for the 21st Century. We must learn from the past, true. We just need to stop living in it.

[Ben Redsell]

Oh and TrollTory I did read John's article in the Telegraph and he was talking about Waveney - Lowestoft has some of the most deprived wards in the Country. FACT.

[Traditional Tory]

Furthermore, its worth remembering that before office, Margaret Thatcher was percieved by both right and left to be totally ideologically vacant (sound familiar?).

That rubbish shows just how much you know Buckers.

Margaret Thatcher was being attacked as a right-wing ideologue from the moment of her election, and indeed before. Remember 'Thatcher milk snatcher'? No, of course you don't.

I recall a particularly bitter and twisted attack from a member of the Tory Reform Group which appeared in the Telegraph almost immediately and landed its author in a lot of hot water (I'm delighted to say)

Thatcher was indeed an ideologue and she offered the nation real and much-needed change.

As George Walden pointed out last week the problem with Cameron is that - despite the empty rhetoric - he offers no change at all; just more of the Blairite same.

[Michael McGowan]

Tory Grandee wags disapproving finger at the hoi polloi and tells them to get back to cake baking and selling raffle tickets. The problem for the likes of Jonathan Marland and the Tory Top Brass is that they are trying to recreate the Tory Party of the 1950's while the rest of the world has moved on.....thank God.

[Alex Swanson]

People who consistently whinge on this blog have probably never delivered a leaflet in their life, especially a Tory one!

I started leaflet-pushing when I was seven years old, and I've done tens of thousands since. That gives me at least the right to whinge if I see fit.

So you don't like Cameron? Fine! But why feel the need to blurt out your anti-Cameron crap day in and day out?

Because some of us believe in truth, justice, freedom and liberty, and have the right to protest when our would-be leaders ignore them.

Get a life! You're morons. And boring ones at that!Go play with the trains!

Ah, more insults. Try bullying if you like, you're impressing no-one and demonstrating only that you're not thinking rationally.

[Traditional Tory]

I did read John's article in the Telegraph and he was talking about Waveney - Lowestoft has some of the most deprived wards in the Country. FACT.

Clearly another one who thinks real poverty means not being able to afford the latest widescreen plasma TV.

Curiously enough it was in the genuinely poverty-stricken borough of Tower Hamlets that I had my one and only 'physical' encounter with Master Hinchcliffe. It was a YC dinner at the infamous Blind Beggar.

All the other YCs were taking the p*** out of him (I was naturally shocked by this dreadful behaviour) but I don't remember him uttering a word all night.

He seems to be making up for it now.

[Hmmmm]

Well said, Alex Swanson. Justin Hinchcliffe's comments show that "nasty party" of the Major era is back.

[Grandee]

Looking back over the past forty to fifty years it becomes very very clear that the Conservative Party have abused the trust placed in them by their grassroots supporters and the electorate. We havn't forgotten this.

They declined to overturn Socialist legislation on just about everything and even supported much of it.

What "Tory principles" does Cameron actually, really, support?

Take the EU, for instance, effective government by foreigners of Great Britain over which we have no effective control whatsoever because our MEPs constitute a tiny minority in this new Soviet bloc. Will Cameron announce that he will withdraw from the EU and resume national government in the United Kingdom, unlike virtually all his precessors in co-called Conservative governments back to Heath?

Will Cameron voice his support for the Established Church and will he repeal Labour's 'constitutional reforms' as well as restore the House of Lords to its status quo. Will Cameron restore all the monarch's rights and privileges quietly excised from Her Majesty (and presumably future monarchs) and will he declare his support for the status quo there including the Act of Settlement?

Toryism has always had as its core roots national and Imperial pride, the support of the monarchy and the Church, the Hereditary principle (upon which the monarchy and our society has always been based) and the Peerage, and all our traditions, heritage and, most importantly, our Institutions.

Will Cameron support these fundamental Tory ideals, or not?

As for cutting taxes. I agree that under Harold Wilson's government our taxes were too high. But direct taxation is not burdensome now so just which taxes will he cut?

Will Cameron abolish the iniquitous Inheritance Tax altogether? Will he restore the married couple's allowance (taken off them by past Conservative governments), abolish or drastically reduce VAT (a tax imposed for the EU), or will he at least remove all VAT from absolute essentials such as water bills and domestic fuel supplies (all introduced by previous Conservative governments) as well as building materials? (Another burden introduced by a previous Conservative government). Will he stop attacking off-shore investments as Brown is doing? Will he reduce rather than increase the gestapo-like powers of the Inland Revenue, who currently bankrupt more people each year in Britain than anyone else.

And while we're on taxes, what about Stamp Duty, and the reintroduction of mortgage tax relief (abolished by a previous Conservative government).

Cameron bangs on about Africa and increasing foreign aid. Doe you or anyone else seriously believe this is a traditional Tory priority or a vote-winner? If so you are deluded and should seek psychiatric assistance.

Was it not a Tory Prime Minister (Macmillan) who announced withdrawal from Empire? (Another betrayal). Those who declined European government must now make their own way in the world. We're out of the picture. Why should we be giving handouts to anyone anywhere when we cannot provide adequate State Pensions for our own people?!

So what will Cameron do about State Pensions? Please don't talk about giving people an extra £1.30 a week. The people are insulted enough at present. Our people need the billions being spent annually on overseas aid and foreign adventures in Afghanistan and Iraq to be directed into their pensions.

Will Cameron instantly withdraw from these American wars?

And, the big question which will ultimately affect the very survival of our nation as an ancient recognisable identity: immigration. Is Cameron aware that at current rates of non-European immigration and births to them our country will mean a majority of non-Europeans in Britain by 2065. Just what radical action does he propose to take about this?

If we look back at the endless promises on immigration made by Conservative governments since 1970 (when they promised a voluntary repatriation scheme where they would encourage immigrants to return home - another empty promise), successive administrations have promised to halt large-scale immigration, and a whole range of other measures, again all total lies. Did they repeal the 1970s Labour Race Relations Bills and close the Stalinist Commission for Racial Equality? No they didn't. In fact they quietly strengthened Race Relations oppression against the indigenous population via the Public Order Acts.

It would bne nice if Cameron repealed to Hunting Bill. But he won't.

You see, you don't have to be very old to sit back and assess how the Conservative Party have become taken over by liberals and in some cases anti-Tories, how they have betrayed every tenet of Toryism and how they continue to abuse it in countless ways.

We have in today's Conservative Party a Mark II Liberal Party and the sooner they change their name to the Social Democrats or something similar, and cease their absolute deception by advertising themselves as Tories, the better it will be for everyone. It will be the first honourable thing (apart from the Falkland's War) they've done for decades.

[Scotty]

What is the point of trying to have a debate on this site when the playground bullies just round around attacking anyone who attempts to engage in one?
Every thread at the moment is littered with an unhelpful minority who just want to wind people up and personally insult or attack the leader of the Conservative party or other posters!

"Before long 'Dave' will feel that knife between his shoulderblades."
Charming! I could have a more adult conversation with my kids about politics at the moment than you get on here with comments like that.
And before you start moaning Trad Tory about other posters, if you keep winding them up with deliberately provocative and unhelpful comments you end up with others getting down to your level, which I guess is the whole point of the exercise for you!

[OneNationTory]

Buckers wrote: Every General Election in living memory has been won on what the public percieve as the centre ground - or it has been won by the party closest to this centre.

Er, no. Elections are won by the party perceived to be the most competent to govern (or the least incompetent). We lost in 97 because of the memory of Black Wednesday, our interest in bickering amongst ourselves and some MPs feathering their own nests; we lost in 01 and 05 largely, though not solely, because people were content with the government because the economy was doing well.

If DC is to be prime minister he firstly needs to convince the country that Brown and Labour are a shambles (which we know they are). But he isn’t doing this; instead he’s wasted (and continues to waste) time, effort and money on re-branding and re-positioning exercises which merely suggest he doesn’t think much of his own party.

Face it – we elected the wrong leader. Davis as leader would be knocking holes in the government. He ain’t got much charisma but it doesn’t matter when the competition is Broon and Ming; the water butt in my garden has more pizzazz than them.

[Traditional Tory]

"Before long 'Dave' will feel that knife between his shoulderblades."
Charming! I could have a more adult conversation with my kids about politics at the moment than you get on here with comments like that.

Sorry Scotty? Are you suggesting that I intended the 'knife' to be other than metaphorical?

I think you know very well what I meant. Thatcher, IDS and - yes - Major were all 'assassinated' and Cameron will be the next one.

What I wrote could appear in any family newspaper. Not so sure about the comments of your 'Roon friends which have lately included 'moron', 'cretin', 'go die in a fire' and, of course, 'Join the BNP'.

I smell a whiff of desperation.

[Alex Swanson]

Every thread at the moment is littered with an unhelpful minority who just want to wind people up and personally insult or attack the leader of the Conservative party or other posters!

Actually:
(1) The complainers want a Conservative Party that actually reflects the values we've always been led to believe it did - as stated above, truth, justice, freedom, liberty. Trying to deny this will win you no friends, only deserved contempt.
(2) The insults largely come, as they always have, from the Left. Unfortunately it's become clear that many on the Left, even in this party, don't think that someone really believes what they say, or is emotionally committed to their beliefs, unless they lose control enough to resort to such behaviour, and hence some people have responded to the provocation. This is a shame, but let's be clear: the natural home of bullying and intolerance is the Left, and always has been.
(3) It is also true that some people just cannot take criticism or disagreement. I had a boss once whose response to anything less than total acceptance of everything he said, no matter how uninformed or nonsensical, was to accuse me of a "negative attitude" and if I persisted of being "anti-management". Telling the truth is an "attack" on no-one except liars.

[Mr Angry]

Cameron, in common with all Leaders, has to EARN support and loyalty from the Party at large. That he is failing to do that is his problem and not everyone else's.

He was not actually elected on a change agenda since he did not in fact present us with a manifesto or agenda for his leadership bid as a result of which many of us feel absolutely conned by him, especially when he reneged on the EPP promise, the one promise that he did make.I for one will get behind Cameron when he gets behind the conservative principles, values and policies that his party believe in, abandons the spin first and foremost culture, and returns to a meritocracy and not the aristocracy.

[Tony Makara]

David Cameron is doing a good job under very difficult circumstances. Its worth remembering that in the next election David Cameron has to appeal to Labour and Liberal voters as well as Conservatives if he is going to win. He has to go to the country with the right balance of policies. These will be Conservative policies but policies that have a broad enough appeal to resonate with most of the electorate. Those who criticize David Cameron clearly do not understand his strategy.

[Ken Adams]

“Its worth remembering that in the next election David Cameron has to appeal to Labour and Liberal voters as well as Conservatives if he is going to win.”

David Cameron is the leader of the “Conservative party” he should first and foremost appeal to Conservatives. In his attempt to appeal to people who would never vote Conservative, he is tuning his back on those of us who would never vote Labour or Liberal because we do not like what they stand for.

[MrB]

Editor, I want to be able to post something positive on these boards. For example, that it's good that we're finally getting some defence of DC's plans in the media, even though some of decisions in the past few months have deserved criticism.

But I really don't feel like it's worth posting anymore because whenever anyone tries to be objective or post something positive, it is constantly undermined by the same old people, day in day out posting almost exactly the same cynical and hate-filled text they post every day. "ETON DAVE NEEDS TO GO, THE KNIVES ARE OUT" etc

People like Traditional Tory- "Before long 'Dave' will feel that knife between his shoulderblades" and who speaks of "The gays" like they're some sort of alien race. Stephen Tolkinghome, who doesn't even support the party anymore but accuses positive posters of being CCHQ plants. Yes they are entitled to their views, but it's exactly the same thing in every thread every day. No attempt at objective analysis, just the same bile. There are pro-cameron examples too, I agree, but not nearly as many.

That's the reason there's a disproportionately hostile amount of posters on here, becuase they try to shout everyone else out of the "debate".

[Tony Makara]

Ken, the main thing is to win the next election. That can only come with a broad based mandate from the people. Then David Cameron will have five years to set the country on a Conservative footing. Implementing the core values that most people in Britain share. David Cameron needs to go to the electorate, get the mandate, then he can build for the future.

[Andrew Lilico]

>Every General Election in living memory has been won on what the public percieve as the centre ground - or it has been won by the party closest to this centre.<

I don't believe this is correct. The Downsian model of voting is a political version of the Hotelling ice-cream stands on the beach metaphor. The idea is that voters will pick whichever party is closest to them, so if we have a left-right line and voters are evenly distributed on it, then the optimal strategy will be to locate in the centre.

Except that it isn't - not even in the pure linear version, once you introduce more than two players. And then, of course, we have the problem that there are many dimensions to voting. And furthermore voters have the option not to vote.

I don't see the Downsian model as in any way informative for modern British politics. And even if it were, it seems to me to involve an essentially leftist view of politics, according to which there is a clash of classes, with each seeking power for its own sake. This just seems to me the wrong way around. We have things that we want to achieve and things we want to prevent, and for these reasons we seek power, not simply as an end in itself.

The right procedure is not, in my view, to seek the centre. Instead, it is to consider who we are and what we want, how that is different from and better than what our opponents are, and how we might (a) persuade the public to agree with us in toto; and (b) enter into coalition with people that do not agree in toto but are sufficiently like-minded that we can achieve the most of what we want to achieve in our generation.

Purity is not a property of a political party - It is the prerogative of a pressure group. But, equally, a Party that is not authentic is likely to degenerate into a populist personality cult - and British voters, mercifully, rarely vote for *that*.

[Traditional Tory]

But I really don't feel like it's worth posting anymore because whenever anyone tries to be objective or post something positive, it is constantly undermined by the same old people, day in day out posting almost exactly the same cynical and hate-filled text they post

Well isn't that a shame MrB. I'll have to have a little toot into my pretty lace handkerchief, just for you.

As you made no fewer than 13 posts to the 'Brown 10% lead' thread alone, repeatedly accusing other contributors of 'spewing out bile' and telling them they should stop posting, pots and kettles spring to mind.

[Andrew Lilico]

Editor

Is there any chance we could ban protracted "discussions about discussions", except on dedicated threads such as Harry Phibb's piece the other day? We could perhaps say that no exchange longer than two emails (one initial comment, one reply) is permitted per user?

[Andrew Lilico]

I know! Perhaps after the two message initial exchange, subsequent messages will be moved to the main "thread-of-the-day" accessible off the Home page?

[michael]

Being on the centre simply means being in touch with the majority of everyday people.

Cameron is spot on in focusing on the NHS, education and social breakdown.

We'll win the next election by making these issues our issues and having a Party which is positive, united and appeals to the aspirational.

People rarely vote on policy detail, they vote for a Party which they feel reflects themselves...that's why being the Party of aspiration, ambition, opportunity and hope is so crucially important...STYLE IS SUBSTANCE in politics.

[steve]

More crap from Traditional Tory.It's amazing that someone could spend so much time on a blog saying the same thing again and again. I'm convinced this bloke is Labour.

[MrB]

Yes, quite right Traditional Tory. I got wound up you see. But I was still objective, I don't agree with DC's direction entirely but I'm willing to let him have a go. At least that is constructive, as opposed to "bile".

In relation to the diary post, it is good to see a balanced critique of Cameron in the media, as I said. Hopefully there'll be one for Brown too, over issues such as the EU treaty, tax and marriage. The cracks in his leadership (which few here seem to mention) could then start to show.

[bill grant]

bear always in mind from where criticism comes!! the lord saatchi. download "smell the coffee" from www.lordashcrroft.com and read the buffoonery of the lord saatchi

[Stand Up Throw Up]

"Cameron is spot on in focusing on the NHS, education and social breakdown."

Exactly Michael. So where are the radical policies to tackle the problems in these areas.

NHS - Lansley's laughable autonomy bill that will create another tier of over-paid managers (I can hear the cheers now down at the local A&E) as well as returning power to the professionals i.e the unions.

Education - Grammar schools or grammar streams? Let's not even go there - Cameron has created a situation where we cannot talk about this subject without risk of violent implosion.

Social breakdown - Policies to encourage the family and discourage single motherhood?

"We will end the war against single mothers and put the weapons beyond use" - DC.

I could go on.....and on.....

[Mr Angry]

MrB, if you are to depart CH, which would be to my mind a shame even though I don't agree with you on most things, then may I perhaps recommend Platform 10 to you. It would seem more suited to your wants in a Conservative Blog being wholly uncritical of and utterly in thrall to Cameron. You will probaly feel more at home there than here.

[MrB]

Platform 10 isn't half the site CH is, and I doubt I will stop posting, but sometimes its just frustrating that people can't be objective and tolerant.

The editorials on this site are brilliantly written, but perhaps we're now better talking about their content =P.

[Editor]

MrB: I'm very aware that the comments on this site can be very negative. Although there is a great deal of unhappiness amongst grassroots Tories I do think the balance of comments is unrepresentative. The monthly survey is much more important as a way of testing true rank and file opinion. I hope my enlistment of columnists like Theresa May, Louise Bagshawe, Peter Franklin and Graeme Archer also helps people to feel that ConservativeHome provides a platform to a diverse group of party voices. The quality of their contributions has, I hope everyone agrees, been very high.

[Mr Angry]

"More crap from Traditional Tory.It's amazing that someone could spend so much time on a blog saying the same thing again and again. I'm convinced this bloke is Labour."

No Steve, he's a Traditional Tory alright.

His views coincide exactly with those just expressed by the membership of my local Assoc to the Exec. Our members have asked for a meeting with our MP in order to convey to him their increasing concern at the direction of the Party, to put it more politely than they did.

[MrB]

Thanks for that reply Editor. Your commitment to providing and equal voice for all sections of the paty is what makes the site such a valuable resource for all Conservatives.

[John Ionides]

Re: deprivation in Ipswich.

You don't really expect someone like TradT to have any idea what is going on beyond the other end of his mouse, do you? Let alone Lowestoft.

When WAS the last time you were on the doorstep, Trad T, and for which party?

[Henry Mayhew - Ukipper / delusional conservative]

Lord Marland should command respect because he seems either to have made his own cash or to be able to do so. That means he is probably a good analyser, listener and persuader.

Let's hear more from him. I am willing to be persuaded by experience.

[Traditional Tory]

Re: deprivation in Ipswich.

You don't really expect someone like TradT to have any idea what is going on beyond the other end of his mouse, do you? Let alone Lowestoft.

As I spent eight years working out on the ground in Tower Hamlets I think I can claim some knowledge of poverty and deprivation, possibly more than most.

Maybe you'd like to tell us all about the appalling problems of deprivation in Trumpington, Cambridge, which I gather is your chosen roost.

When WAS the last time you were on the doorstep, Trad T, and for which party?

Since you ask, it was this year for a Conservative councillor many miles from here who is a personal friend. There were no elections in my borough this year.

Having looked at what I take to be your website, I rather think I was canvassing for this party before you were born.

[steve]

Mr Angry, what views? All he does is attack Cameron in every post.That is a pretty brainless way of approaching politics.I'm sorry for you if that is the way your association thinks too.
This site does seem very good and some of the discussions on Platform and the columnists are really interesting. It's just some of the comments that are crap.

[Mr Angry]

"Lord Marland should command respect because he seems either to have made his own cash or to be able to do so. That means he is probably a good analyser, listener and persuader."

Ditto Lord's Ashcroft, Kalms & Saatchi, as well as Tom Cowie, Henry. However they all have differing views on the Cameron strategy, so which one is right then???

[Torygirl]

Mr. Angry at 16:06 - "His views coincide exactly with those just expressed by the membership of my local Assoc to the Exec. Our members have asked for a meeting with our MP in order to convey to him their increasing concern at the direction of the Party, to put it more politely than they did".

After our last meeting a lot of people have said they will not vote for our MP again, or renew their membership.

This used to be one of the safest Conservative seats in Britain, it is now a marginal with the Lib/Dems breathing down the neck of our Tory MP (one of Cameron's closest aides). He was lucky to get elected last time, but I think it could well switch to Lib/Dem next time, not that he will care as he has a very lucrative position in the City and already told me personally that he will go back to his old job.

Grandee at 12:07 You are spot on. Unfortunately we are wasting our time as those now in charge of the Party are not Conservatives but progressives. The Labour candidate at the last GE in 2005 told a friend that "****** (our MP) and I are as one, we are both progressives".

Another friend had a long meeting with our MP just 6 weeks ago. He asked him what the party was going to do about all the muslims coming into the country and he was told "That is racist - I have many friends in the City who are Muslim". My friend said "Two of them have just tried to blow up Glasgow Airport this morning" and he was told there was no proof that they were Muslim!!

I thought we had elected him to defend our traditional British way of life, but it seems he doesn't care a jot for the country, only what he puts in his pocket and pension fund.

[Paul Oakley]

Careful Traditional Tory. You're giving away too many clues as to your secret identity today. Keep up the mystique, eh?

[John Ionides]

Trumpington actually has a rather greater range of living conditions than you might expect but these things are all relative and compared with the area near New Cross where I grew up it is certainly hunky-dory. But, like many places, there are parts of the ward that do struggle. Try Hanover Court and Princess Court, for instance (Cambridge's two, rather well hidden, tower blocks).

In fact, my chosen roost right now is the north-east suburbs of St Petersburg, and I assure you that if the good residents of Tower Hamlets think they've got it bad they should come and look at some of the places here.

I don't doubt that you have been on doorsteps since I was a wee nipper (and probably before). But there do seem to be large gaps in your awareness which makes me suspect that your activity on the street has waned. But I am sure you worked most tenaciously in Tower Hamlets, and I regret that you haven't been able to spend more time there of late.

Which party were you active for, by the way?

[steve]

All very cryptic Torygirl. Which MP are you talking about?

[Traditional Tory]

But there do seem to be large gaps in your awareness

Such as?

which makes me suspect that your activity on the street has waned.

Indeed. Unlike some I no longer have any interest in obtaining a nice little earner on the council.

But I am sure you worked most tenaciously in Tower Hamlets

Yes. For my employer. The Tories did not waste much time banging on doors there. It was as much as we could do to get the leaflets round.

Which party were you active for, by the way?

I won't dignify that with a reply. BTW, since you have apparently moved to Russia I assume you have resigned your council seat?

[Torygirl]

All very cryptic Torygirl. Which MP are you talking about?

Have a guess!! I'll tell you if you are right.

[John Coles]

Why oh why are accusations of cowardice, membership of the BNP and the use of crude language, allowed on this, otherwise, civilised site?

[Editor]

This thread has exceeded its useful life.