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Just watched Nick Herbert with Peter Sissons on the BBC and then on Sky - absolutely first class performances.

When the ferries come over from Belfast and arrive in Birkenhead I suppose passengers are strip-searched for handguns ?

The future Conservative government must impose a severe sentence for the illegal possession of firearms. A prison term of ten years, without remission, even for a first offense, would be welcomed by the public. While guns are on our streets gang-shootings and criminality will only increase. In the case of gun-crime the sentence must be strong enough to deter, the threat of a ten year prison term would make people think twice about whether it would be worth owning a gun illegally.

So when are we going to demand that life should mean exactly what it says?

Or better still, that we support the return of capital punishment?

We also need to vastly simplify the Firearms Act so that the Police aren't wasting resources hassling farmers with their shotguns. Generally speaking, not even the Police know the law, least of all understand it, and most of it is outdated and all but irrelevent in todays streets anyway.

The future Conservative government must impose a severe sentence for the illegal possession of firearms. A prison term of ten years,


Gun Laws

I refer you Tony to Firearms (Amendment) Act, 1997 and Firearms (Amendment) (No. 2) Act, 1997 where the penalties you describe already pertain

The Governmenmt has effectively de-regulated gun ownership. Those who want them or need them in their criminal activities will get them, but anyone else wishing to join a gun club or do sport shooting will be criminalised by so doing. There will even be an Act of Parliament suspending the law for the Olympics but in the meantime the GB team must train in Switzerland.

Consistency would demand the event be banned, but we even have the Goernment wanting foreign armed policemen on patrol in London !

The response to this horrific tragedy has been extremely encouraging and a vast improvement on the responses to the various events over the summer. More of the same please!

Traditional Tory, I agree with you on both counts. I think most people in this country would support a referendum on the restoration of capital punishment. The problem is even if a future Conservative government were willing, we are not allowed to have such a referendum because of Europe. I certainly agree with you that life should mean life, except in certain cases as when deemed to be very young at the time of the offence. It saddens me greatly when I read local papers and hear stories of killers who have been released for murders committed in the 1990s, for I remember reading about the killings and it only seems like they happened yesterday.

Tomtom, I see your point. The whole question of sentencing over illegal gun possession needs to be addressed. I agree also that the legal gun-owning fraternity should not be made to suffer for the actions of those dealing in contraband weapons.

"Those who want them or need them in their criminal activities will get them, but anyone else wishing to join a gun club or do sport shooting will be criminalised by so doing."

Then why did I hear a minister recently saying they will encourage young men to take shooting lessons to give them a sort of father figure and to teach them discipline. (he sounded serious)

Then why did I hear a minister recently saying they will encourage young men to take shooting lessons to give them a sort of father figure and to teach them discipline. (he sounded serious) - 601

Sorry - after 10 years of NuLab you still think that because a minister says something it bears some connection to reality? Have you heard a Gordon Brown budget speech?

Well said David Davis, especially that last paragraph.

Let's do some Labour bashing!

TomM, Labours speeches are classics! My favourite is the 1999 conference speech when we were told that Britain can look forward to 'full employment'. Watching Labour speeches is a bit like watching 'Fantasy Island' or 'Westworld' where you can make your dreams come true! Except it isn't real.

A very interesting article over on the Observer website:

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/leaders/story/0,,2156374,00.html

Interesting not only because even the spartists on the Observers leader column have finally conceded that having more police on the street might have some merit but because of the response of the readers to their attempt to downplay the whole 'anarchy in the UK' thing - you know the Tories are onto something when even Guardian readers are agreeing with them.

This is an excellent article by David Davis and he makes some very relevant points on how the Government has failed to get a grip on gun crime and what it must do. I do hope Jacqui Smith will act on this matter (for example, by deploying more on-street PCs), but I won’t hold my breath.

If Michael Howard had still been The leader of the Conservative party and had stuck to the same line on which he fought the last election we would now been in the enviable position of being able to say "I told you so".
This proves that one should always stick to what you know to be right, not what is temporarily trendy. Events will eventually prove you correct.

"The future Conservative government must impose a severe sentence for the illegal possession of firearms."

Here's a thought: 10-20-Life. That's the basic scheme of mandatory sentences for gun crime here in Florida. Be in possession of a firearm during the commission of a felony (a crime punished by a year or more in prison), mandatory 10 years; draw the gun, 20 years; shoot someone, life in prison (with no eligibility for parole until you've 25 years of that life sentence).

Of course, Florida also has one of the friendliest environments for LEGAL gun ownership. The two are not mutually exclusive.

Alarming to note that some Tories here are tending towards the trigger-happy gun culture of the USA where anybody who calls for gun control is branded a communist.

Is this to be the new cowboy Tory policy we must ask ourselves?

There's a frontier brutality about it which has much in common with the excesses of Thatcherism.

When anyone proposes a Bill of Rights to replace the ECHR remember the 1689 Bill of Rights and the Clause That the Subjects which are Protestants may have Arms for their Defence suitable to their Conditions and as allowed by Law.

So readily have people accepted Parliament may change that Clause that it is pointless expecting any Bill of Rights passed through a U K Parliament to be meaningful or worthwhile

Alistair:

Baaaaaaaaa Baaaaaaaaa Baaaaaaaaaa

Pathetic!

Alistair, "The excesses of Thatcherism" please explain what you mean or is that just yet another New Labour statement masquerading as fact?

Mmm, Alistair, you are shouting at the wrong audience. My advice to you Mr Lebouski, Sir, is get a job.

Getting back to the gun thing. Davis gets 2 column inches in News of the World. Nick Herbert is meanwile doing a fantasic job on all the major news networks. Just listened to his interview on BBC news, great stuff. We need more shadows with his ability to deal with the media.

"If Michael Howard had still been The leader of the Conservative party and had stuck to the same line on which he fought the last election we would now been in the enviable position of being able to say "I told you so".
This proves that one should always stick to what you know to be right, not what is temporarily trendy. Events will eventually prove you correct."


I'm a Cameroon, but I think that's an excellent point.

Edison, there is something in this, but looking back in politics is a non-starter. Cameron has come across very well in all this, and Howard, being now a comentator also has had his moment. I actually think Howard has only really flourished in his interviews since the shackles of leadership were removed - just look at the cringing way he dismantled Campbell on Newsnight. Priceless.

I totaly agree anyone even found with a wearon be it gun or knife should have an immediate 10 yr prison sentence. So why arent we building places to put them... Oh and have the tories ( as I don't yet know ) agree to pay for lots more prison [email protected] doctors ect in those newly built prisons.

So 10 year sentence for having a gun but only 10-12 years for Murder....so there is no incentive not to use the gun to resist arrest.

So 10 year sentence for having a gun but only 10-12 years for Murder....so there is no incentive not to use the gun to resist arrest.

Increasing sentences will not solve the problem, just as banning handguns haven't worked either. I am beginning to wonder why Labour want power, as they clearly have no ambition or plans in government other than simply keeping the Tories out.

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