Voters want Brown to cut immigration and bring troops home

The Tory lead has been trimmed slightly in today's YouGov survey for The Sunday Times but we should remember that Labour also received a temporary boost after Tony Blair's last resignation speech - in October 2006 at the Labour conference.  In the immediate afterglow of Thursday's resignation, 49% thought Tony Blair had been a good PM overall and 46% thought he had been a poor PM.  Those Tories inclined to make hysterical attacks on Tony Blair should pause first and think on those numbers.

Gordon Brown supporters will be concerned that the Tory lead widens to 42% to 32% when voters are asked to make a choice between a Cameron-led Conservative Party and a Brown-led Labour Party.

The LibDems will be concerned to see that post the local elections their party has fallen back again.  PoliticalBetting.com's Mike Smithson has spotlighted the issue of Menzies Campbell's leadership again this morning.

If Gordon Brown is looking to restore his popularity he needs to restore control of Britain's borders according to YouGov.  60% of those polled want a reduction in immigration.  49% want troops home from Iraq. Iraq may be the most important decision of Gordon Brown's leadership bid.  There is a great deal of talk that he is planning a major repositioning speech in which he will talk very frankly about what went wrong in the lead up to the decision to go to war and in the prosecution of the war.

Comments

[Jennifer Wells]

If only Cameron would get ahead on the immigration issue before Brown. Now he's done all of the repositioning we have credibility on borders issues. Don't we?

[Curly]

On top of all this, I note that the workforce at MacCavity Brown is threatening strike action over the use of Polish labour!

[John Marsh]

The Tories are too frightened and cowardly to dare to mention the word immigration.

[Vote Freedom]

Fancy that the British public want Immigration sorted. Yet if the only party which defends Britain mentions that, they get lambasted for being racist. Maybe it is the lies you have peddled which makes the situation bad for you all.

How can you on the one hand attack the BNP and say immigration is great and wonderful for the country and just what we need and anyone who stands against it is a nazi/fascist/racist (delete as applicable) and then you get polls like this in which 60% of the nations people tell you that they see the reality of what is happening and want immigration sorting.

Whilst we have a million plus people unemployed and a many more leaving the country in a brain drain we need to stop all immigration and sort the country out first. And look after our own people the same as any other country does in the world.

But of coutse it doesnt fit in with the classless society which labour wants and they are creating by replacing class with multi culturalism thus diluting the British nation. And you have the Tories which enjoy the cheap and ready labour which drive down wages and make ready made servants.

[Vote Freedom]

Why is only one poll mentioned, I am surprised you have not quoted the Brown as leader one which puts the Tories on 42% and Labour led by Brown on 32%

[Jennifer Wells]

The 42% to 32% finding is in the second paragraph Vote Freedom but I wouldn't expect a BNP supporter to be able to read properly.

[Michael Hewlett]

You would struggle to find anyone who would support unrestricted immigration, this should not give the BNP any comfort to future political success.

Unlike the BNP, the British people are a fair minded country, who welcome the input of new inhabitants and celebrate the diversity this brings. The Alf Garnetts of the world belong to a different age and it's sad to see the BNP banging the same old drum.

Vote Freedom, you always come out posting when there is any hint of a debate on immigration or ethnic minorities. As on election day when you were predicting electoral meltdown for the Tory party. You will be equally wrong to believe that your racist, insular and hateful views will ever get support from the nation at large.

Why don't you stick to blogging on your own website and leave the sensible political debate to serious commentators on CONHOME.

[TomTom]

are a fair minded country, who welcome the input of new inhabitants and celebrate the diversity this brings. The Alf Garnetts of the world belong to a different age and it's sad to see the BNP banging the same old drum.

You are highly amusing Michael Hewlett...Alf Garnett was a fictional charaxter invented by Johnny Speight to keep Tony Blair's father-in-law in work....he was a satirical figure.

I am interested that you reject this satire and see that borders must be closed. Just how much diversity do you have where you live and how much is your home worth on the market?

[Vote Freedom]

TomTom

I am guessing the nearest they get to diversity is having their Latte's served by an immigrant or having cheap labour servants such as nannys and gardeners and plumbers.

It transcribes what I was saying before Labour want the flooding of this country by others to remove the class structure and have some sort of multi cultural incampment. And the Tories enjoy the slave labour market.

If you wish to discuss other policies. What about the pension grab back by Gordon Brown which the tories bang on about and how it has taken Billions from pension funds. I am still to hear if the Tories would replace what Gordon Brown took away.

This is why the British public don't trust you because as I said before you can not bang on about how bad something is and how bad people are who support that stance wether it be against the iraq war/questioning the immigration problem/ seeking a defence of the British way of life/ or taking us out of european control.

You can't win arguements by calling people names and then wish to jump on the band wagon when it comes to light that it is these very things which the British people are bothered about.

And immigration does efect every part of British life.

It has aided the increas in house prices by the increased rental market.

It has driven down wages and ensured all jobs wether skilled or not are serviced at a minimum wage. Whilst a million people are still on the unemployment list.

It has put a strain on health services and education. As well as councils who have had to deal with incredible amounts of translation and community support systems which they simply can't handle.

Police have given up arresting immigrants due to the fact that they hold no records on any of the influx of people so have to treat everyone as though it is their first offence, and due to the fact of over crowding they cant arrest them to ensure they can confirm their identities so they simply change identities each time they are caught.

And the biggest sick joke of all was the leafleting of unison saying how if the BNP was elected they would cut the 30% of foriegn doctors and nurses which the NHS needs. yet this year alone thousands upon thousands of nurses and doctors will have been trained up at this governments expense and have no jobs to go to, so will end up emigrating to abroad. Where is the sense of hiring at great expense foriegn doctors yet at greater expense training British people who will in the end work abroad.

Yes they are many more problems but the state of this country and how you treat the people within it does reach to every part of society. And you have had 30 years or more to deal with it.

The only way you deal with it, is to make a witch hunt out of anyone who dare stand up and state facts and gag anyone else from freedom of speech. And if all else fails call them names.

[Richard Shackleton]

Add in a couple of low/zero cost populist measures such as a windfall tax on banks...(or those that appear to be overcharging for going into the red) and maybe a renationalisation or two of the worst performing train companies...and I think you have the makings of a "cut 'n run" election manifesto.

[Vote Freedom]

Richard,

As I recall didn't labour promise a fat cat windfall. Yet the profits now are beyond obscene.

With any British owned company being swalloed up by foriegn investors which chew up and spit out the companies.

I think it will take a lot more then superficial headline grabing policies the British people want something of substance something in which they can trust.

Trust is what will win any party the next election or in the case of what will happen the illusion of trust.

[Graham D'Amiral]

Controlled immigration is a perfectly fair and reasonable aspiration, but that is very different from the BNP's anti immigration policy.

As for this poll generally not surprising with all the focus on the labour leadership from the media that they are doing slightly better, though I note conservative support has increased and any labour improvement comes at the lib dems expense.

But as the article states it must be a concern to Labour that Gordon Brown (currently engaged in his one man election campaign) will start his premiership so far behind David Cameron.

Also those figures about Tony Blair's record are fascinating give or take a couple of percentage points the nation is pretty much divided in half about whether his record has been a good one. So certainly claiming everything he has done has been a disaster is a dangerous tactic as it is a view with which half the electorate do not agree.

[Michael Hewlett]

TOMTOM, I don't recall discussing closing borders but stated that nobody would support unrestricted immigration. Two very different arguments, it is because of the complexity of these issues that small extreme parties will never thankfully be in a position to influence public policy. As with vote freedom, I'd suggest you are on the wrong website and should restrict your blogging to bnp, ukip etc and leave the serious politics to others.

[TomTom]

But as the article states it must be a concern to Labour that Gordon Brown (currently engaged in his one man election campaign) will start his premiership so far behind David Cameron.

Last time I looked we still had constituencies and winning constituency-by-constituency favours Labour because it takes fewer votes to elect a Labour MP than a Conservative MP

[Graham D'Amiral]

It is fair to say that David Cameron's ten point lead over Gordon Brown may not translate in to a ten point conservative lead (though we shall see how things go in time).

But I trust you'd accept the leader is the most important figure within a political party, and a prime minister heading a government more than a decade old being so much more unpopular than his opponent is hardly an encouraging sign.

[EML]

The NHS is also on that list of important issues. I can't see Brown making any sort of announcement on immigration, at least not until he's safely ensconced in 10 Downing Street.

Of course we need a policy on immigration, but we need a firm policy on the NHS more (and sooner).

[AlexW]

If the BNP aren't racist, does anyone care to explain their views on interracial marriage?

[Michael Hewlett]

While it might be fun to spend the day blogging with unreconstructed racists, I alas have to get on with a typical Sunday. Which will involve passing my friendly muslim neighbour in the flat below, whereby I will go to the local cafe (ran by an Australian) and read the sunday papers (brought from the local Asian cornershop) concluding the day with sorting out some property DIY with the local Irish maintenance company. 21st century Britain in all it's diversity!

[malcolm]

I suspect we will see a bit of an upturn in Labour polling in the next few weeks as the media concentrates its gaze exclusively on the Labour party. I hope that my political bias has not completely clouded my judgement when I say that I don't think the first three days of the Brown 'leadership campaign ' has been particularly impressive at all. He's in the difficult position of being the architect of too many mistakes by Labour,taking responsibility for the failure of the Dome will not be enough.
I'm stunned that 49% of my countrymen think Tony Blair has been a good prime minister. Do we live in the same country or even on the same planet. I hope this is just a polling error.

[TomTom]

As with vote freedom, I'd suggest you are on the wrong website and should restrict your blogging to bnp, ukip etc and leave the serious politics to others.

Posted by: Michael Hewlett | May 13, 2007 at 10:58

I think little boy you should run home to mummy and have a good weep. It is your puerility that has sullied politics in this country for the past decade.

Stop trying to tell others what may or may not be said as if you are a People's Commissar or Witchfinder-General. Your ilke would do well to remain more contemplative and learn before exposing your thorough anti-democratic credentials and antipathy towards free speech.

[ToMTom]

But I trust you'd accept the leader is the most important figure within a political party, and a prime minister heading a government more than a decade old being so much more unpopular than his opponent is hardly an encouraging sign.

I see your point and it has validity, however I observe a large part of the country locally with swings against the Conservatives in 2006 and 2007 and only one Consevative MP in a whole county with a very small marginal majority

[Dontmakemelaugh]

If the BNP aren't racist, does anyone care to explain their views on interracial marriage?

Posted by: AlexW | May 13, 2007 at 11:26

I believe that the leader of the BNP has expressed his opinion of miscegenation as to be undesirable. I must say that you do get a kick out of seeing the family resemblance in the grandchildren, but as far as I am aware the BNP isn't going to make miscegenation (I hope I do not sound like Ollie Letwin(d), but it is the correct word) unlawful. I would not vote for any Party that made it lawful, the choice is that of the individual.
I understand that the whole of the Asian community is aghast and reject the opinion of the BNP leader and can't wait to see their offsprings marry into the families of the indgenious population and to abolish faith (race) schools.

[Dontmakemelaugh]

Whoops! to clear up any misunderstanding in post at 1215 it should read that I would not vote for any Party that made inter-racial marriage unlawful - just incase there are those that misunderstand.

[ToMTom]

for any Party that made inter-racial marriage unlawful

Impossible to do under the European Charter, and under the European Convention on Human Rights.......just another red herring....like Gordon Brown and his Written Constitution - it would have to be approved by the European Court of Justice AND the European Court of Human Rights before it could even be considered

[Denis Cooper]

"Controlled immigration is a perfectly fair and reasonable aspiration"

I'm not sure where "fairness" even comes into this.

This is our country, and we should decide whether we want to invite people from abroad to come and share it with us, and if so how many, and which people etc.

None of them have any legal or moral right to come here, unless we the existing body of citizens choose to grant them that right. What we decide is fair, is fair.

There's no legitimate external standard which states eg that a million immigrants a year into the UK would be too many to be "fair", but a hundred thousand a year would be "fair", while zero immigration would be "unfair".

[mark]

I second Tom Tom's remarks at 1204 and agree with Denis Cooper at 1256.
The problem is one of perspective, to many people under 50 it must appear that however relaxed you are about your country's security, nothing can or will ever go wrong. It's all very well to extend a welcome to all and sundry whilst this country lives in a false economic boom but wait until it all unravels. If we regressed economically to the equivalent of the post war Britain that I was born into I wonder if the likes of Michael Hewlett would be willing to share scarce resources with millions of people who have no ancestoral rights in this land.

[Alan S]

Brown needs to cut taxes for middle England. He needs to control immigration. He needs to accelerate troop withdrawals from Iraq. He needs to oppose the Constitution. He needs to increase police numbers. He'll then keep the Labour base and detach Cameron from core Tories.

[Lord Cashcroft]

They're in for a shock. Brown is building some spanking new 'eco' towns for them to live in.

[601]

" I can't see Brown making any sort of announcement on immigration, at least not until he's safely ensconced in 10 Downing Street."

Don't count on it I heard Broon when he made that speech in Stevenage and it sounded a lot like Cameron when he started talking about social responsibility (ofcourse what he says and what he has done over ten years are two different things).

He also said the NHS is his priority. Loooks like he is going to steal all of the Tories clothes.

[TomTom]

He also said the NHS is his priority.

It has to be. He has a big Unison March on 13th October against his pay norm.

On 1st August his hospitals melt down as the disaster of MMC and MTAS together with the CRB mean there are no doctors employed in NHS hospitals and consultations are cancelled and waiting lists explode.

This coming winter is going to be a very turbulent one in the NHS and Brown has a firestorm coming his way

[comstock]

Gordon Brown supporters will be concerned that the Tory lead widens to 42% to 32% when voters are asked to make a choice between a Cameron-led Conservative Party and a Brown-led Labour Party.

hmmm, I find that figure slightly incompatitable with the rest of the opinion poll. Blair has gone and most people surely know that Brown is a racing certainty to become next Labour leader.

More likely is that people prefer Cameron to Brown, not the same as saying they would actually vote Conservative......

[Yet Another Anon]

49% want troops home from Iraq
This is slowly happening, the Iraqi Security Forces strengthen by the day and it is by keeping forces where they are needed as long as they are needed that will allow for a satisfactory withdrawal.

[Goldie]

These numbers are simply not good enough, they will inevitably tighten -- and thus produce another term for Labour rather than a workable majority for the Conservatives.

The "Project" has been working well enough, but it's not enough, it's not good enough, it cannot deliver. DC needs to change things.

[RodS]

"While it might be fun to spend the day blogging with unreconstructed racists, I alas have to get on with a typical Sunday. Which will involve passing my friendly muslim neighbour in the flat below"

Do you know what your friendly neighbour is planning for or which radical preacher his sons are listening to ?

[Jack Stone]

Goldie what utter absolute nonsense. Harold Wilson once said a weeks a long time in politics, it seems your memory doesn`t last that long.The local election results showed what a great job David Cameron is doing and how much progress the party is making.There can be no going back or turns to the right now. The only way forward is the way that as been set by the present leader and that is also the only way to get Brown out of Downing Street.
As for the posts by Vote Freedom and TomTom. We all know there views on race and immigration.Thank god there not held by the decent majority in this country.

[TomTom]

As for the posts by Vote Freedom and TomTom. We all know there views on race and immigration.Thank god there not held by the decent majority in this country.

If you continue to libel me Jack Stone I shall consider whether the Case Law set under Godfrey v. Demon Internet Ltd,2001 is something you should answer for.

The fact that I consider you mentally-disturbed is the reason I have let your libellous statements pass thus far. I do however find you impose too much on the good nature of people in your personalised and derogatory remarks.

You don't know my views on anything Jack Straw because you do not read but are simply one who reacts in a knee-jerk manner with limited intellect to the point of being intermninably boring, lacking in any analystical capability, and simply a reciter of slogans

[malcolm]

If you do take Jack Stone to court Tomtom please would you publicise the date and venue of when and where it is due to heard. I would pay good money to come and watch!
PS They probably don't allow laptops into the courtroom so it will be difficult to go to google or wikipidia to find obscure facts relevant or irrelevant to your case.

[Lamedon]

The only technical problem with controlled immigration is that it has always turned into an uncontrolled one. I would say this is a fatal flaw.

I would also say that sharia courts operating in the UK, rising criminality and the destruction of enviroment should also be matters of urgency.

As far as the BNP is concerned it us up to the people to decide in polls. They are legal and they have a right to stand in elections, raise questions and mantain their own policies.

[comstock]

If you continue to libel me Jack Stone I shall consider whether the Case Law set under Godfrey v. Demon Internet Ltd,2001 is something you should answer for.

I'm only reading a quick synopsis, but wouldn't that involve suing 'Jack Stone's ISP rather than him personally?

Or would it be ConHome's ISP that would be liable to pay the damages?

I'm just glad I'm too poor to be worth suing! :D

[Michael Hewlett]

TomTom must have some serious legal training to see anything even closely warranting libel action from Jack Stone's post. But as Malcolm pointed out (astute posting) enough googling will present a number of case names to put forward.

I too would visit the court for that case, if only to see someone with such strong views on immigration suing rather than being sued!

[comstock]

TomTom must have some serious legal training to see anything even closely warranting libel action from Jack Stone's post.

In any case, and I could very well be wrong, don't you have to have had damage to your 'good name' before you can sue someone for damages?

As TomTom contributes anonymously, I fail to see how that could apply here.

I'm just sorry They probably don't allow laptops into the courtroom Tim could send Sam to do a live blogging thread whilst the case is in progress :D

[Richard]

If Jack Stone is who I think he is, he's rather experienced at libel action.

[Denis Cooper]

Correct, comstock, there are some advantages to posting on the internet under
a pseudonym, but it does rule out the possibility of sueing for libel. On the other hand, I post under my real name, and I don't much care for this "Jack Stone" or anybody else suggesting that I must be "racist" because I believe that we should return to the previous official policy of "would-be zero immigration" which applied from 1962 to 1997. On balance the established population of this country gains nothing (in fact less than nothing) from mass immigration, yet we are expected
to be happy about giving away free shares in our country to all-comers, and if we demur we're told we're "racist" and should shut up. Not good enough, I'm afraid.

[TomTom]

if only to see someone with such strong views on immigration suing rather than being sued!

To accuse someone of "racism" is to accuse them of a criminal offence.....and your supposition that TomTom is not a name known within my community just as Jack Stone is known in the Web community by plastering his telephone number everywhere....is a presumption

[Webland]

Name: Jack Stone [ m ]

I'm from: Southend on Sea, England and I'm 47.
My native language is: English
My other language/s: None.
Hobbies: Walking my dog, tracing my family tree, music,
COMMENTS: I am also interested in reading, the environment and animals, especially dogs.

[YHN]

"You don't know my views on anything Jack Straw because you do not read but are simply one who reacts in a knee-jerk manner with limited intellect to the point of being intermninably boring, lacking in any analystical capability, and simply a reciter of slogans"

And you smell like poo.

[Sherlock]

"If you do take Jack Stone to court Tomtom"

If he is the Jack Stone who lives in Old Southend Road I wouldn't bother.

I just checked his credit rating, and that stinks too.