Five reasons why members should retain the right to rank MEPs

An overnight email from the Direct Democracy campaigning group to its subscribers warns the Conservative Party against diluting members' right to select candidates at the next European elections:

"The Conservative Party has in recent years taken the lead in opening itself up to democracy - in contrast to Labour, party members have the decisive vote over their leader, and many constituency associations have embraced our idea for open primary selection of candidates. Which makes a recent proposal by the party's National European Forum all the more worrying.  This obscure body, a kind of retirement home for Heathites, has unveiled a scheme to get rid of Eurosceptic candidates for the European Parliament. It wants to take the vote away from ordinary party members who, since the party list system was introduced, have been allowed to rank their candidates in order of preference. Instead, the ranking - at least of the top part of the lists, where it counts - will be done by small committees of party officers... Taking the vote away from the members and centralising it in the hands of party worthies would be a shocking assault on localist and democratic principles. if the Tories were to do such a thing in Opposition, why should anyone trust them to decentralise power in office?"

ConservativeHome wrote to David Cameron about this issue a few weeks ago and, from a conversation I had with his spokesman, I no longer expect an answer.  The spokesman told me that the party leader expected to be consulted by the party board before it voted on how selection procedures might change.  Mr Cameron would give his opinion to the board and privately.  I then spoke to Francis Maude to hear whether he would be urging protection of existing one member, one vote ranking of all MEP candidates.  He was non-committal.  If, as I now expect, the party goes ahead with this retreat from democracy in the selection of MEPs there will be five consequences:

1. The party board will have further undermined its already weak claim to speak for party members.  A ConservativeHome poll found overwhelming support for members keeping their vote.  The board, remember, was the body that attempted to take the vote away from members in the leadership election.
2. Party rhetoric on trusting people and sharing responsibility will look a bit thin.  The party will have shown itself unwilling to trust its own members to select MEP candidates.
3. Many members will struggle to campaign for candidates with Europhile voting records that they did not get a chance to approve.
4. UKIP and other fringe parties will be able to campaign against many of our MEPs and their support for still deeper European integration.
5. We will have lost the opportunity to fashion a genuinely Eurosceptic group of MEPs that is in tune with David Cameron's ambition to leave the EPP.

The party will go ahead anyway because they fear that any delisted MEPs will immediately leave the Tory grouping in the European Parliament and sit with the LibDems.  If that is where their true instincts lie I think we should not be afraid of them leaving.

Comments

[Andrew Woodman]

If associations and members are taken out of the process, where does CCHQ think the money is going to come from to fund the European campiagn?

[Matt Davis]

I agree entirely with the Editor on this point and feel very very strongly indeed that this pernicious anti democratic measure must not be implemented. If it is then I will be strongly questioning my continued membership of a party that is prepared to so completely ignore the views of its membership, activists and electorate. If we do lose our say on MEP selections then I will most certainly not be campaigning in the Euro elections either way.

[Michael McGowan]

The taxpayer, Andrew, via extortion i.e.compulsory state funding of political parties.

[Cameron Watt]

I fully agree, Editor - a retreat from democracy on this would show that the party leadership does not trust or respect its members as it should.

[Sean Fear]

Well, if this does go through, I shall participate in the process, so far as I can as a constituency Chairman, and then I shall resign from the Conservative Party. Following the implementation of this proposal, we would never leave the EPP, as we would continue to select MEPs who share their commitment to European political integration.

Were this to take place, I would certainly vote, and probably campaign, for UKIP in 2009.

[Adrian Owens]

I am completely opposed to any move in this direction. I hope you are wrong Editor and that wiser heads will prevail.

[Tim Aker]

Why is the party establishment so afraid of the europhiles to the extent that they'll try and rob the membership of the democratic right to select their representatives?

Face down the Europhiles (Beazley, Jackson, Evans and Kirkhopeless) and tell them that conservatism, as it now stands, will never be for the type of Europe they want and if they want to stand up for a federal Europe, im sure a few of us eurosceptics here on conhome will chip in to pay for their Lib Dem membership.

[Michael McGowan]

Tim records that Francis Maude was "non-committal". Well there's a big surprise .....this being the man who worked very hard, and deployed all sorts of cock-and-bull arguments in 2005, to deprive members of a vote in the leadership election. This is the Tory Party after all and nothing changes: perish the thought that grandees should be accountable.

[rancher]

The Editor is clearly right on this.

What odd comments from Cameron's spokesman!

Is this the same Spokesman who stood for UKIP in the 1999 European Elections?

[HF]

My Branch would not deliver any leaflets or do any campaigning if we do not have the right to choose the candidates. I will not vote Tory if there are any Europhiles on the ticket.

David Cameron, if these Euro MEPs want to shift to the Lib Dem block then let them go the sooner the better.

They already vote as if they were Lib Dems. Particularly their Leader. So let this be your Clause 4 moment.

At least let us have the selection early so that those further down the list have time to secure alternative employment.

This story seems based on something that would have been probably threatened by Kirkhope, can anyone shed light on it.

[James]

What I find so bizarre about this is...why why why is the leadership acting to protect MEPs who are basically party rebels, and openly working to undermine Cameron? I could at least see the cynicism in trying to safeguard the position of fanatical loyalists (although I would completely disapprove) - but this is utter madness. It would destroy the coherence that IDS and MH worked to forge on Europe at a stroke. And there is a very good chance that the general election will be on the same day - so any Euro rows will play a big role in the GE campaign.
DC, Board members - please please don't blow the party open just to protect the gravy train of some quais-LDs who aren't representative of the party. There are plenty of Eurosceptic female, gay, and ethnic minority cnadidates who'll happily take Kirkhope's place!

[Richard ROBINSON]

I have argued repeatedly for members to be given the widest role in selecting and ranking European Candidates, but I think that the above comments are unfair both to Francis Maude and to David Cameron.

The Party Board is about to make a decision on this contentious issue and once it has done so, Francis, David and the rest of us need to get behind that decision. It is therefore not surprising that at this stage they should not want to take a public position that may be overtaken by events. I don't believe that we can infer what will be their private advise to the Board from their refusal at this stage to comment publicly.

If this goes against us, I hope that Matt and Sean will reconsider and join me in working for the largest possible Conservative vote in the 2009 European Elections and the return of a Consrvative government in Westminster. That is still the best way to advance the cause of reform in the EU.

[Sean Fear]

"What I find so bizarre about this is...why why why is the leadership acting to protect MEPs who are basically party rebels, "

They share their point of view?

[Londoner]

Perhaps this party committee has been hijacked by UKIP trolls. I can think of few actions that is more likely to boost UKIP votes amongst Tory Party members than this.

One of the advantages of the previous system is that as the most influential and politically-minded activists take part in the selection process, there is a certain loyalty to the list that emerges, even if one might not have voted for all the people near the top. This helps to neutralise the inevitable mutual suspicions between europhiles and eurosceptics (and one can through this process see the quality of the candidates of whom one might not be natural soulmates). Bearing in mind their large constituencies it is also usually about the only chance one gets as an ordinary member of any formal "report back" from the sitting MEPs.

Maude could try a simple question addressed to, say, constituency officers who are not Chairmen of their Associations. "If you had no chance to participate in the selection or ranking of your MEP candidates, would that make you (a) more likely or (b) less likely to play an active role in the campaign (or (c) no difference)?" It only takes a few moments' thought to know the answer. One could also add: if you never hear the candidates speak when they are selected would that make you more or less likely to praise their quality to friends and acquaintances?

These selections have also been excellent at throwing up new stars - Theresa Villiers was unknown before she was selected for the London No 1 slot, and a few short years later she is in the Shadow Cabinet. Would a small party committee have been so bold?

[Alan S]

Tim - will your new campaign venture launch video attacks on all Europhile candidates that the party allows to stay on the list? Unless the party feels threatened NOW they will go ahead with this outrage.

[Jennifer Wells]

"What I find so bizarre about this is...why why why is the leadership acting to protect MEPs who are basically party rebels, "

Because they fear an outcry by the euro/constitution-loving MEPs who grassroots Tories will not want to readopt.

[Occasional Visitor]

Make UK representation EU even more out outside of democratic influence?

Whom the gods would destroy, they first make mad.

[Richard Weatherill]

This is very worrying news. I'm particularly surprised that Francis Maude is being non-committal on this subject. When I discussed it with him just before Christmas, he gave me the strong impression that the NEF proposal would be treated by the Party with the contempt it deserves. (Maybe he just thought that was what I wanted to hear.)

Do we know when the Board will be making a decision on this proposal? Like Sean, I shall leave the Party if it is adopted.

[Jack Stone]

Children being shot on the street and in there own beds, soldiers being killed in Iraq and Afganistan, the NHS in crisis and a government that is the most corrupt and incompetant we have seen for generations and still we have the Conservative right obsessed by Europe. So obsessed they would rather see another Labour government elected at the next election if they don`t get there way on every single thing to do with Europe.
Those who say they will leave the party are traitors to there country and traitors to all those suffering under this government.

[Richard Weatherill]

How dare you call me a traitor? Go and spread your poison elsewhere.

[Sean Fear]

"Those who say they will leave the party are traitors to there country and traitors to all those suffering under this government"

LOL! That's the first time I've ever heard treason equated with non-membership of the Conservative Party.

[William Norton]

Jack Stone is right to focus on the real issues. The deplorable collapse in the standards of spelling and grammar under this Labour government, for instance.

[Andrew Woodman]

Jack, this is about democracy. The only reason I will campaign in the Euros is because Roger Helmer is my MEP. If I lived in Yorkshire, I couldn't campaign for candidates who have different beliefs to mine, and I don't think I could bring myself to vote for them. I don't rwally consider that to be 'treason'. I think that accusion would be better levelled at those who gave away the sovereignty of the UK.

[michael mcgough]

Now I know why John Bowis ,Tory MEP for London and a VP of the EPP party was so CONFIDENT (AND WILLING TO BE QUOTED ) in betting that the Tories would still be in the EPP in 2010 .He made this prediction whilst joining in the launch of www.speakupeurope.eu in London.

[Christina]

William Norton wrote:

"Jack Stone is right to focus on the real issues. The deplorable collapse in the standards of spelling and grammar under this Labour government, for instance."

ROTFL!!!

It's very funny how Jack and others of his ilk refute 'extremism' with their own version!

As a UKIP member who shares this site's vision of the 'And theory' being implemented, I'm rather skeptical that Tim has got his report right. I cannot imagine that Cameron would be so stupid as to deny the membership a say on who should be chosen to represent them as potential MEPs.

Although UKIP would benefit from such a decision, I'd rather see Conservative MEP candidates who are truly EU-skeptic and UKIP MEP candidates co-operating at election time, as Nigel Farage has offered with regards to the Better Off Out campaign.

[Matt Davis]

I'm sorry Richard Robinson but this is a matter of great principle to me and many others within the Tory party. (Remember principles Jack Stone? .... No probably not.)

Supporting and giving a considerable part of my life to the Party is something I do from conviction and principle, it's not football supporting you know, "my team right or wrong".I'm not blue because I'm blue because I'm blue, I'm a Tory because I hold certain views and believe that they are of vital importance to our country. If the party to which I commit so much would treat the views of the majority of its members and voters with such contempt in order to preserve the cosy little lifestyles of some blatantly Europhile MEP's (and Jack it is they who are really the traitors by the way to both our party and our nation) then it isn't a party worth giving up my time, efforts and money for.

Francis if you are reading this then ask yourself this question: Can you actually win anything electorally if all you have left on the ground are Jack Stone and John Bowis???

[Prentiz]

I guess that the party's worry on this is not really an ideologically motivated desire to protect europhile MEPS, but a concern about the effect that a public squabble with them will have on Cameron's plan to change the tory brand. Arguments about Europe are very 1996, after all.

If this is true, he's missing a trick in not pushing for the most democratic selection possible - because it protects him and the party brand from criticism for the decision. Indeed it would be a very strong argument for open primary selection for our european candidates - something which could very well help us pull dissaffected UKIP voters back into our fold...

Anyone not selected would look li

[Prentiz]

(oops)...would look like they were suffering from sour grapes.

[CDM]

While this isn't great news, it seems a little premature of Sean Fear and Richard Weatherill to start threatening resignation.

What exactly would it achieve? It certainly won't help rid Britain of the present Labour Government, which should be everyone right-thinking person's first priority.

[deborah]

"The Party Board is about to make a decision on this contentious issue and once it has done so, Francis, David and the rest of us need to get behind that decision."

Why?
Matt Davis is right. Francis, David and the rest of us should only get behind decisions if we agree with them. That is called principle-based politics and it is what Cameron said he stood for.

[CDM]

In any case, it's not like the European Parliament has any power worth speaking of! Several people have told me that the vast majority of MEPs have little idea about what they're voting for.

[T R Oll]

Several people have told me that the vast majority of MEPs have little idea about what they're voting for. (CDM, 17:48)

Like people voting Tory in European elections.

[Justin Hinchcliffe]

"...were this to take place, I would certainly vote, and probably campaign, for UKIP in 2009" - Sean Fear @ 14:48.

Sean, I think you will come to regret this threat. Certainly, "toys" and "prams" spring to mind...

Jack Stone is right to say that we should be focusing on the big stories of the day (Europe isn't one of them!). Talking amongst ourselves on a subject which is alien to most voters, let alone of any interest, is madness.

I think the vast majority of our MEPs do a good job in standing up for Britain in Europe. As a Conservative member and an Association Chairman, I am happy for them to continue doing so.

[Justin Hinchcliffe]

"...were this to take place, I would certainly vote, and probably campaign, for UKIP in 2009" - Sean Fear @ 14:48.

Sean, I think you will come to regret this threat. Certainly, "toys" and "prams" spring to mind...

Jack Stone is right to say that we should be focusing on the big stories of the day (Europe isn't one of them!). Talking amongst ourselves on a subject which is alien to most voters, let alone of any interest, is madness.

I think the vast majority of our MEPs do a good job in standing up for Britain in Europe. As a Conservative member and an Association Chairman, I am happy for them to continue doing so.

[Matt Davis]

Justin you are obviously not familiar with Denis Thatcher's bon mot regarding it being better to stay silent and have people think you a fool than to open your mouth and prove it.You are better than that post, as your own blog clearly shows, even if you have put it up twice.I know that the LibDems believe that repeating a lie will make it into a truth but I'm not sure that a similar approach on CH will suceed.

Jack Stone is not right about Europe and neither are you, Europe absolutely is one of the big stories of the day, it's just that the europhiles are scared of it because they are in a tiny minority within both the party and the country and so they try to stifle debate rather than lose the argument again. In fact the voters care a great deal about the very many things that adversely affect them as a result of ever greater euro integration and the creeping loss of our ability to govern ourselves as we may see fit.It is certainly not "alien" to them, not anymore it isn't.

Finally if you think that all of our MEPs are doing a good job of standing up for Britain then that sadly shows how little you have looked into the European Parliament and the Conservative's voting record within it.

[Justin Hinchcliffe]

Matt, I'm not sure which Matt you are - the Tory or UKIP one :-)

To set the record straight, I am not a Europhile - I am a moderate Eurosceptic who is not obsessed with the subject.

As for not knowing about the EU, even Syed Kamall is impressed with my knowledge of European legalisation, the workings of the EU Parliament and the groupings within it - he told me so over lunch the other day...

[Sarahty]

Justin is right. Some of us are just not obsessed with hating Europe like a small minority here.

If we want to continue our influence, it has to be from within the EPP, and that means with the experienced MEP's who have been forging strong relationships within it.

[RodS]

Why is Jack Stone still allowed on this site - the hight of treachery is to turn a blind eye to the creeping cancer that is the EU. I have already resigned as a constituency Deputy Chairman - a betrayal on this scale would end my links with the party altogether. Surely Hague/Fox/Davis will block it !!

[Justin Hinchcliffe]

"Why is Jack Stone still allowed on this site - the hight of treachery is to turn a blind eye to the creeping cancer that is the EU..."

Are you really that intolerant, RodS? Don't you realise that the Conservative Party is a broadchurch?

[RodS]

"Are you really that intolerant, RodS? Don't you realise that the Conservative Party is a broadchurch?"

The Conservative Party is becoming 'broad' in the way that a swamp is broad. I joined a party that had direction and momemtum - more like a river !!

[Christina]

Sarahty wrote:

"Justin is right. Some of us are just not obsessed with hating Europe like a small minority here."

Although I am not accusing Sarah of lying in what she wrote, as it is a popular myth and she may know some Conservatives who do in fact hate the rest of Europe, the idea that most of us who want out of the EU are Europe haters, is a pernicious lie worthy of the Lib Dems, but not Conservatives.

We do not hate Europe, we are opposed to a political process of integration because, in fact, we actually love our European neighbours and believe the 'one size fits all mentality' of the EU is damaging to ALL the countries in Europe, not just the UK.

We want businesses to thrive throughout Europe, not be tied down with all the red tape the EU imposes.

I see the difference between myself and a Conservative with similar views, as being that I don't believe the proposed reforms are workable, though if I am wrong then I will be glad for that small mercy.

I would prefer a Conservative government, but not if it is basically the same as New Labout.

[Sarahty]

Christina,

David Cameron wrote to LibDem not UKIP elected officials to join his modern Conservative Party and that was for a reason.

The LibDems are not 'mad europhiles' who accept the EU without questioning. It is a question of reform and change from within, and there is no better or bigger group to achieve that than the EPP.

David and his team have recognised that, and they know they cannot win the support of LibDems by standing on the edge of Europe ranting like a mad kangaroo to appeal to a handful of those with a special narrow view.

[Richard]

"Are you really that intolerant, RodS? Don't you realise that the Conservative Party is a broadchurch?"

The issue we have with the likes of Jack Stone is not their Europhilia but their (probably deliberate) hyperbolic and OTT attacks on staunch Eurosceptics. Almost as silly is their attempt to pretend that they're not in the minority and that those who chime with the public mood on Europe are "extremists", "xenophobes" etc. Similarly, I get bored whenever Eurosceptics make OTT attacks on Europhiles ("traitor" etc).

[Dontmakemelaugh]

Are you really that intolerant, RodS? Don't you realise that the Conservative Party is a broadchurch?

Posted by: Justin Hinchcliffe | April 16, 2007 at 19:07

In most broadchurches the pews are emptying, but outside the church cemetery is growing.

[Sean Fear]

Let me explain. The EPP has demonstrated repeatedly that its values are alien to those of the vast majority of Conservative supporters. David Cameron has promised to pull out of the EPP by 2009, notwithstanding that most of our MEPs favour remaining within the EPP. They find its views a good deal more compatible than those of most Conservative supporters.

If our MEPs are effectively guaranteed reselection, as a result of these proposed changes, then we will not be leaving the EPP in 2009, and David Cameron will have broken his promise. We will be effectively deceiving the electorate - posing as eurosceptics, while remaining part of an organisation that is committed to European political integration.

I don't want to be party to that deception.

[Sean Fear]

"The LibDems are not 'mad europhiles' who accept the EU without questioning"

On the contrary they are. The Lib Demss' views on the EU are shared by a very small minority of the population, and I'm at a loss to understand why we should aim to appeal to them.

[Christina]

Sarah and Sean,

I don't where the Lib Dems are exactly on the EU, but I do know the Orange Book is as Sarah describes, critical of the EU and seeking reform. The Orange Book also critices those Lib Dems who do give the impression of 'the EU right or wrong.'

As far as the kangaroo statement you made, Sarah, I think you should take on board the post immediately after yours.

[Game Over]

Blue Labour love being told what to do by the EU.

What a shambles you lot are.

[Richard]

"I don't where the Lib Dems are exactly on the EU, but I do know the Orange Book is as Sarah describes, critical of the EU and seeking reform."

The Orange Book is not highly thought of by most Lib Dems who are further to the Left. Even though they may give lip service to reform the fact is that the Lib Dems are ideologically internationalist and suspicious of calls for greater national sovereignty, confusing it with aggressive BNP-style nationalism.

[Billy Goats-Gruff III]

I see 'Sarahty' has emerged from under the bridge to stir up trouble with deliberately provocative language yet again.

Let's not feed the trolls folks.

[Billy Goats-Gruff III]

See this thread for Sarah's previous form on this subject.

Interestingly, she seemed to favour EPP withdrawal on that occasion but here we are a few weeks later and she's saying that remaining within the EPP is the best bet.

Another troll butted off the bridge.

[Matt Davis]

My final word on this has to be to point out to Sarahty and anyone who agrees with her that the Eurosceptics are in the great majority in both the Conservative party and the country generally. The EPP is a quisling federalist set up whose interests are largely diametrically opposed to those of the UK and our leader has promised us that the Tories will no longer be a part of that particular gravy train. Sadly those who personally benefit the most from EPP membership are now fighting a rearguard action to preserve their various perks and sinecures by means of a deeply anti-democratic move to disenfranchise the members of our party solely in their own personal interests. It is quite frankly a disgrace and an affront to democracy, and nothing said by anyone above justifies that in even the slightest way.

If what you want is a LibDem Europhile party then go and join it and stop trying to detroy the Tories from within, because let's face it that is the real agenda.

[Cllr Graham Smith]

Tim, I very much hope that your fears are unfounded and that David Cameron and the Board will not seek to create unnecessary division over this issue.

[Sarahty]

Mr Billy Goat. Leaving the EPP only made sense when we thought we could achieve a strong grouping outside, however that now looks impossible, so the only way forward is to be realistic and make the best of what we have got. But then I guess you are another UKIP troll who thinks that there is only one possible choice! Politics is about the possible, not impossible dreams.

[Michael McGowan]

"So the only way forward is to be realistic and make the best of what we have got": namely, an increasingly remote oligarchy full of placemen and women feathering their own nests at the taxpayers' expense. Is it a surprise that so many ordinary people totally distrust the major parties?

[edmund]

dont' you thinik Sarahtv that it's a bad precdent for a party leader to treat their pledges on election as a joke? ( incidentally I do think we can still get a group together but even assuming thta......)

Do you accept that the membership should select euro meps or do you actually think it's good to have a stich up instead?

[Sean Fear]

Supposedly, the Czech governing party is set to join us in a new group in 2009. What is the point of reneging on our commitment, for fear of offending a few europhile MEP?

[Tapestry]

It has been perfectly obvious ever since Cameron's false promise on the EPP that the party hierarchy intends to lie and lie about its real intentions re the EU.

It's time for all concerned to smell the coffee.
The Cameron regime has done a deal with the Eurofanatic wing to cheat the majority.

I don't know why we bother listening to any of it.

William Hague is the front line of the continuing deception of the majority of Conservatives, the only party which might get the UK out of the EU.

Liam Fox is the only one you can trust on this issue, but of course he's gay - or will be accused of some such by the media if he were to look like winning the leadership at any stage.

This whole thing stinks to high heaven. When will the Conservative excise its rotten stinking corrupt disloyal rump of europhiliacs? If we do that, then Britain might once more become a country worth living in.

[Justin Hinchcliffe]

Supposedly, the Czech governing party is set to join us in a new group in 2009. What is the point of reneging on our commitment, for fear of offending a few europhile MEP?

Posted by: Sean Fear | April 17, 2007 at 11:32

Thw Czech government also supports the Euro and wants to be part of it. Where does that leave you, Sean?

[michael mcgough]

"Where does that leave you, Sean?"

Clearly BETTER OF OUT of the EU altogether.

[Denis Cooper]

Cameron stated clearly that the Tory MEPs should not be part of the EPP and should leave, without adding any preconditions about forming another group.

The criteria for official recognition of groups within the European Parliament have been stitched up to deliberately restrict the number of groups, to force them to be multi-national groups, and to concentrate power in the fewest possible hands. Once Hague persuaded Cameron that he should play the federalists' game on their own terms he was sunk.

[Sarahty]

We all wanted that Denis, but it is not working out the way it was hoped.

Surely you would not advocate jumping ship into a tiny group without a single hope of being listened to?

What would that achieve in terms of reform? The EPP is the biggest grouping within the EP.

Is not change from within the true conservative way? Leaving the EPP to join the MER, as it stands would be like leaving the Conservative Party to join UKIP.

[Chris Whiteside]

It really ought to be possible to have a constructive debate on this important point without people from any viewpoint within the party threatening to resign, accusing one another of being traitors, etc. I assume and hope most of the insults on this thread come from UKIP and New Labour trolls; their parties are the only people who will benefit if we get into another slanging match with one another over Europe.

I remember sitting through the final selections for the 1999 and 2004 Euro elections. We introduced rolling primaries at multiple venues last time; for the first one I and about 800 other people spent an entire day in an enormous marquee listening to speeches from 16 candidates. (Gave a whole new meaning to the political expression "Big Tent.")

I lost count of the number of times during that day that I cursed the Labour government for accepting the introduction of closed regional party lists, not least because it made a proper democratic selection so damnably difficult to organise. Let us not forget who are the real architects of the problem, or that our main aim should be to get them out of office.

And one thing we must not fail to do when we have removed Labour is go through the EU rulebook with a fine tooth comb to find a way to introduce a less undemocratic means of electing MEPs.

However, difficult though it is to operate democratically under this system, I think it would be a backward move to take the right to vote on Euro-candidates away from our members. I very much hope that those who think the party is about to attempt to do such a thing are wrong.

And if the board does want to go down this avenue, I think the party constitution means that such a proposal has to be put to the National Conservative Convention. If this happens, I hope and expect that it will be voted down.

Incidentally, neither side should assume that a democratic vote among all party members is guaranteed to mean the deselection of pro-european MEPs. All our existing MEPs were selected under the present system, and most of them have come through it twice.

[Richard Carey]

I assume and hope most of the insults on this thread come from UKIP and New Labour trolls; their parties are the only people who will benefit if we get into another slanging match with one another over Europe.

I quite agree with your point, Chris. Perhaps those who get so agitated about their rights in the selection of EP candidates might stop and think that they're not doing their cause any good. Whenever this kind of subject arises on CH.com we (trolls notwithstanding) really don't do ourselves any credit when colleagues resort to over-the-top rhetoric and threats of ejecting the toys from the pram.

As far as selection mechanisms go, my recommendation would always be for them to be more open rather than less. Open primaries have been a great success in Westminster selections, and while the exact model might be more difficult over an EP region, for us to retreat from this and seek to close down European selections might not seem consistent. However, if you were looking for an excuse to do a selection on the quiet, some of the bile and bluster on this thread does seem to provide the best excuse anyone would ever need!

Go for the very best quality candidates willing to stand on the Party’s policy platform, and let the rest take care of itself. Rather than obsessing about ‘phile and ‘phobe, behave like a responsible selectorate and look outwards to promote mechanisms to give more people a say in the process. if you’re confident in your arguments, then this will stand far more chance of delivering the result you want.