George Osborne on Today

George Osborne was good on the Today programme at 7.09am this morning but he spoilt his performance at the end.  He was good in that he highlighted the craftiness of the Chancellor and the fact that you cannot trust what he says.  Mr Osborne reinforced the crucial point that it is the craftiness/ slyness/ lack of honesty that Mr Brown has displayed as Chancellor that makes people sceptical about him becoming Prime Minister.  Where Mr Osborne would have confused people was in his suggestion that Brown was in some ways imitating Project Cameron.  He said that on sharing the proceeds of growth, the environment and families, Labour was copying Conservative ideas.  I don't think that's true.  Yesterday Mr Brown did not share the proceeds of growth between lower taxes and extra spending - yesterday's budget increased taxes very slightly (and after years of substantial tax hikes).  Yesterday Mr Brown did not introduce green taxes of the kind the Tories are proposing - in fact he ridiculed Tory plans for taxation of domestic flights.  And, thirdly, and most importantly he distanced himself from David Cameron's support for marriage.

I'm afraid that it's more true that the Tories are imitating Gordon Brown.  The Tories only propose modest reductions in taxation and refuse to make the supply-side case for lower taxation... they have largely accepted his European levels of public spending... and they are afraid to seriously reform Labour's complex maze of tax credits.  I still think on tax and the economy George Osborne will be better for the economy and much more more honest than Gordon Brown but the gap between the Tory and Labour positions is far too small for my liking.

Comments

[Steve]

Spot on. The trouble with taking on policies that are designed to win an election and not fix anything is you will always look shallow, because you are.

We have to understand that the choice at the next election; are we serious about change or governing? I cannot defend our current policy because they make no sense. I cannot think of any leader of the Tory party that couldnt beat this lot.

Spending has to fall over the next few years to balance the books even under Browns forecasts, by not identifying this we are creating a future problem.

We need to offer conservative policies not flaky, uninspiring, doomed 'ideas'. Those who realise current policy and direction have failed completely want an alternative. If we continue with incoherent policies we will still win the next election but for what purpose?

[TomTom]

Osborne would improve if he used short focused sentences and remembered you cannot make more than 3 points at most.

He needs to focus on the inadequacy of Brown's choices in view of the imminent economic problems we shall import from the USA and the dependency on importing Savings from China and Japan and Taiwan generated from our huge trade deficit second only to the USA......and that Brown borrows the Defence Budget each year and he is paying the same amount in interest charges annually.

Mr Micawber

[Observer]

The simple truth is that Brown wants to make England jut like Scotland....One Party controlling One State Economy

[Alex Forsyth]

I'm afraid that it's more true that the Tories are imitating Gordon Brown.

This is why an increasing number of Conservatives are becoming alienated from the Cameron party.

And as long as we attempt to play by rules which the socialists dictate, they will continue to outflank us.

[Richard Carey]

This is why an increasing number of Conservatives are becoming alienated from the Cameron party.

And despite Brown's cynical attempt to build his advance to No 10 on the back of the poorest strivers, you would still rather attack your colleagues in the Conservative Party rather than the nascent Brown Government?

Says it all, really, doesn't it Alex...

[EML]

I though Osborne was poor. I like what Cameron is doing, but his sidekick just doesn't sound like a chancellor in waiting.

I think the following quote from the BBC sums it up:

BBC economics correspondent Hugh Pym said that the changes meant someone on £14,000 a year would pay an extra £90 in tax and National Insurance - but that would be offset by claiming working tax credit.

Ergo less well off people will pay more in tax to this robbing socialist git unless they prostrate themselves infront of him and fill in his lengthy and confusing tax credit forms. It's humiliating and downright authoritarian to take money off people and force them to ask for it back.

[Dave Bartlett]

Mr Osborne also has a budget post up at Webcameron, "A tax con, not a tax cut."

[TomTom]

you would still rather attack your colleagues in the Conservative Party rather than the nascent Brown Government?

That is illogical....if Alex Forsyth thinks the approach is wrong he cannot simply sign up to whatever approach those opposed to Brown dream up.....it might not be appealing to the electorate.

I think Rihard Carey you would do well to bait the hook to please the fish and not the fisherman.

Yesterday Brown shot a few Conservatives foxes and left the electorate wondering about how big tax cuts need to be to compensate for Conservative taxation on flying.......

Someone had better do some deep thinking and market testing of policy before 2008 or Cameron might be earning his living on the rubber-chicken circuit.

There are around 40 million voters and 16 million did not vote in 2005. The May Elections will probably get around 25-30 million not voting.

Those non-voters pay taxes and are turned off party-politics. The number of people who say they don't know who to vote for but loathe this government is very large.........so don't attack Alex Forsyth for querying the strategy....debate it....if you can

[Praguetory]

Generally good but could have been a bit more forceful.

[Old Hack]

As with all budgets the devil is in the detail. No Chancellor likes to front-up the nasties and Osborne should give himself time and space to exploit the bad news later on. Don't know whether he has - but its a tough job given what Brown did.

Ed - your point about the gap is an instinctual one I suspect and its one I personally share. But what exactly should Osborne be saying at this stage?

Surely the main objective for the moment is to gain power, not provide hostages to fortune which inevitably occurs when you start talking about lower taxes etc?

My god I sound like changetowin, better go and take some tablets!

[Frank McGarry]

Damian Reece in the DT Business section said today that Brown "displayed the duplicitous nature any effective political operator needs".
The conventional wisdom is now that honesty doesn't pay. Deceit, dishonesty, duplicity worked for Clinton, Kohl, Blair and Brown - and for the European project too. Is this the way for Conservatives too? I hope not.

[Scotty]

"But what exactly should Osborne be saying at this stage?

Surely the main objective for the moment is to gain power, not provide hostages to fortune which inevitably occurs when you start talking about lower taxes etc?"
Old Hack, don't take the medicine you are completely correct in your comments.
Those that think the Conservative party should bang on about/make the case for tax cuts now just don't get the reason why Labour and now the Conservatives have faced so many years in the political wilderness.
Labour could not win on a socialist tax raising/distribution strategy back in the 90's any more than the tories can win on a tax cutting one now.
The public want stability and that is something which has been ingrained through the "sick man of Europe" in the 70's and the boom and bust of the 80's. You do not win elections by running campaigns which highlight negative perceptions of your party.
Brown stuck to Clarke's spending plans for two years after 97' and only after gaining the trust of the public with the economy did he start implementing his social redistribution policies. We have to prove that we can afford to give the public genuine tax cuts without harshly starving the public services, and you don't do that by promising tax cuts before you have even got into power and attempt to tackle the waste or without real reform.
The voters would like more money to spend, but they are still as protective of their public services and don't yet have an appetite to gamble on less tax not being at the expense of the NHS, home security, policing or education.

[sjm]

As ever, it's a Budget that will take your money away from you, send it through extremely expensive bureaucratic hoops, and possibly give a tiny bit back if someone judges that you might just qualify, and then they'll cock the process up anyway.

I just wish a Tory spokesman would put it as simply as that on Today etc.

[Scotty]

The George Osborne needs to highlight the fact that not only has this budget hurt the poorer hard working public, it does nothing to encourage others back to work.
It has also made many of those in that group much more dependent on the complicated and means tested tax credit system.
A simple message to the public that we will get rid of this Brown invented black hole and simple make them better off at the source of their pay packet is vital.
Family tax credits and the shambles, stress and hardship they have delivered to the very people they should be helping is Brown's biggest weakness and we need to exploit it.
Why should hard working families have to jump through hoops and reams of paper work to claim something which a simple fairer tax regime in their pay packet would do quickly and efficiently.
Honest people who have filled out these forms correctly and done nothing fraudulent are being faced with huge claw back demands and threats as if they have run up huge personal debts through choice!

[Dave Bartlett]

Just listened to Mr Brown's Today interview with John Humphries. JH raised the point of the huge off-the-books PFI debt, GB brushed it aside, but if the conservatives follow up on the 'where's the money gone' theme perhaps the PFI debt will be difficult to explain away.

My impression was that Mr Humphries was more hostile to Mr Osborne than Mr Brown.

It would have been more interesting if the Today people could have had Brown and Osborne back-to-back rather than having Osborne at 7:10am, and Brown at 8:10am

[Helen Thomas]

This job is too big for Osbourne.

[Mark Wadsworth]

Osborne was on fine form to say he must have got out of bed pretty early today.

I agree he should have rammed home the point made by EML at 9.05

[malcolm]

A small point, but George has a very irritating voice which lacks any sort of gravitas.He should go and consult a voice coach as Mrs Thatcher did.

[MH]

I disagree that Osborne was ahead on this. He came across as very lightweight and almost circuitous on the issues of comparisons with what Conservative policy is / might be. Hugely unimpressive.

[Richard Carey]

so don't attack Alex Forsyth for querying the strategy....debate it....if you can

Given AF's usual posture on here, I'll attack hin on anything I like within the rules of debate. And there was a substantive point to my post, through the link - the fact that Brown has attacked the working poor the hardest in his Budget, to fund a political reduction in headline rates, and that that should be just one focus of our attacks on the Budget.

You would be well advised to go and patronise somebody else, "TomTom"...

[TomTom]

You would be well advised to go and patronise somebody else, "TomTom"...

Posted by: Richard Carey | March 22, 2007 at 13:03

NO. I think I'll patronise you Richard Carey. You seem to need it !

[malcolm]

Don't feel bad Richard,Tomtom patronises everybody! I'm struggling to think of a single positive thing he's had to say about anybody or anything. It must be tough to be such a genius when everybody else is obviously so stupid.

[TomTom]

It must be tough to be such a genius when everybody else is obviously so stupid.

Thanks for being so understanding Malcolm...you are mellowing ! :-)

[David Sergeant]

Back to the budget. I am a bit perplexed about Brown shooting Tory foxes and even if he did the idea that he made out a budget mainly to do that surely is easy to attack. The problem, as always, is the Tories do not have spokesmen capable of coping with out and out political crooks that Labour AND the Lib/Dems now comprise. They treat them, and BBC interviewers, as reasonable people trying, at least, to do reasonable things when none of them are.

A suggestion; the 10% tax rate is a way of encouraging the low paid to earn more without losing chunks of the increased earnings. Cameron should say he will bring it back as Labour have stifled social movement.

[David Sergeant]

" they have largely accepted his European levels of public spending... "

Really editor where have you been for 20 years. When the Tories were in power every NHS foulup was blamed on the the Tories for "underfunding". Now, haven't you noticed how doctors now get blamed? Sorry, Europeon levels of funding are the only way for the foreseeable future. Can we stop this hysterical stuff about tax cuts.

[TomTom]

George Osborne is drowning in a broadcast on Radio 4 at this moment...it is such a juvenile performance and soporific. If Osborne continues like this Brown would sail through a General Election - he is hopeless