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"Yet the time might be ripe for Cameron. Blair has said he'll step down before the fall."

I assume they mean "the autumn", but the Americanism does make the phrase gloriously ambiguous (with theological overtones for good measure).

Probably not a good idea to mention Cameron and sniffing in the same breath....

Time Magazine Man of the Year 1938 Adolf Hitler

Most of the article is about Cameron's similarity to Blair, not to JFK.

Greg Barker is quoted in it saying "We're still seen as the nasty party". I thought we'd ditched the self-abuse approach ages ago?

Greg Barker is quoted in it saying "We're still seen as the nasty party".

Probably quoting his wife

Cameron makes a worrying comment in the article "Margaret Thatcher was facing a Britain that was economically bankrupt and going down the pan, and she had to give Britain back a successful economy, which she did. But today, we face very different challenges. It's much more about social breakdown, the new environmental challenges, the security challenges. It's a different environment."

I would argue that given the current level of overspend by this government we are very much facing an economically bankrupt country by the time of the next election. Brown's extensive mortgaging of the future have place us in a difficuly position yet for some reason Cameron either does not recognise or chooses not to recognise this issue. Without a successful economy all of the other issues mentioned fade into the background.

Typical piece of yankee puffery.
How dare they interfere in our internal politics by doing profiles.
Like all things yankee it is skin deep and meaningless....the media equivalent of "have a nice day".

The Q&A is excellent and should be read. Very strong on Europe. I don't think Justin Hinchcliffe will like Cameron's stance on the Euro and the Constitution or EPP at all.

I do though!

"Now, you can hardly find a politician who wants to join the single currency, so I think the Conservative Party is in the right position. The idea of bringing back a constitution with lots of transfer of power from the nation states to the center is complete head-in-the-sand. The French and the Dutch voted no. This constitution is dead. It doesn't matter how hard you try to do mouth-to-mouth resuscitation — to mix my metaphors — this bird is not going to fly. So the Conservative Party is in a rather strong position."

and

"I said the Conservative Party shouldn't sit with the European People's Party in the European Parliament after 2009, after the next elections, because at the end of the day, although there are many things we agree with the EEP about in terms of economy and immigration, we don't agree about the fundamental issue about the future direction of Europe....This issue of the constitution rather proves my point that it's going to be promoted by a number of people who sit in the European People's Party, and we will be staunchly against it."

"The Q&A is excellent and should be read. Very strong on Europe. I don't think Justin Hinchcliffe will like Cameron's stance on the Euro and the Constitution or EPP at all."

That's not the point. Cameron is weakest, and least ambitious, on the stuff that matters most: effective public service reform, lower taxes, welfare reform.

No party is taking the UK into the euro. But we do have a problem getting leaders of any of the parties to take seriously the difficult and controversial steps necessary to actually take life in this country forward. Labour Party leaders have become progressively more interested in these reforms (but not nearly enough to get anything worthwhile done). Sadly, Tory Party leaders have become progressively less interested in tackling these areas.

[i]Greg Barker is quoted in it saying "We're still seen as the nasty party". I thought we'd ditched the self-abuse approach ages ago?[/i]

Yes, a lot of Tories seem to have problems with self-abuse.

The Yankee MSM will love Cameron in much the same way that they love McCain. The question is Will it last?

TomTom: "Time Magazine Man of the Year 1938 Adolf Hitler"

The comparison with Hitler is pathetic, and you should be ashamed of yourself. Disgraceful.

Anon says: "Cameron makes a worrying comment in the article "Margaret Thatcher was facing a Britain that was economically bankrupt and going down the pan...

Brown's extensive mortgaging of the future have place us in a difficuly position yet for some reason Cameron either does not recognise or chooses not to recognise this issue. Without a successful economy all of the other issues mentioned fade into the background."

Hmm. Could failure to recognoise (or act) on the issue have anything to do with Thatcher's pet economist, Tim Congdon, jumping ship for UKIP?

I notice, too, that Camerloon repeats his claim of redeeming his pledge to leave the EPP in 2009. But what happens if they can't form a grouping, as now? Will he say "Sorry, folks, we tried", and stay where they are?

Is Nigel Farage in next weeks issue ? He's the saviour of the Uk after all (ahem).

More like Britains KFC.

IE Chicken.

At least he's keeping the promises he made when elected as leader, unlike some who say "come back in 3 years time" :-)

TomTom: "Time Magazine Man of the Year 1938 Adolf Hitler"

The comparison with Hitler is pathetic, and you should be ashamed of yourself. Disgraceful.

Posted by: bee | January 25, 2007 at 15:43

Well Little Bee let me explain so simply that even you might comprehend (sorry for the big word there).

In 1938 Time Magazine run by Henry Luce was so in touch with the world that his publication put Adolf Hitler on its front page for his brilliant diplomatic coup at Munich in 1938.

Imagine that Little Bee - Time Magazine peering across the Atlantic Ocean saw a brilliant statesman in Adolf Hitler who had secured agreement on dismembering Czechoslovakia. This was the great coup celebrated by Time Magazine.

http://www.thirdreich.net/AH_Man_of_Year.html

and in 1939 it was Josef Stalin


Now Little Bee what does this have to do with David Cameron ? Not a thing. It has everthing to do with Time Magazine and its disastrous history on picking covers. It is widely held in the United States that any Fund Manager who appears on the cover of Time Magazine has peaked and is about to begin rapid decline.

It is a very bad sign to be on the cover of Time Magazine, but you probably haven't a clue have you Little Bee ?

Don't be stupid. Many of the Year isn't laudatory. GWBush was 2004's Man of the Year, and TIME hate him. It isn't meant as an act of praise, but rather of description: which person was responsible for the biggest, most historically important events, trends, or movements.

I see the Grocer got two, but the Iron Lady got three... Plenty of other British PMs featured, too... I'm not sure that they were all cursed by appearing on the cover of Time, Tom Tom :-)

JFK acceded to the Presidency having fought in the Second World War as a decorated Navy commander, served in the House, in the Senate, won a Pullitzer Prize and having carved out a reputation as an expert on International Affairs.

Moreover, he was interested in policy.

Kennedy was a disappointing President, but a fair greater prospect, sad to say, than Cameron.

Yes, well, to get back to the serious stuff. Cameron says "we want to be in the European Union" but "we are opposed to further integration of the European Union." The problem here is that the existing EU treaties have been deliberately designed to promote a process of further integration. That's why the preamble commits all EU member states to the principle of "ever closer union", which means exactly what it says - union, getting ever closer, forever and ever amen.

Logically if Cameron opposes further integration he must oppose the existing EU treaties, but if he opposes the existing EU treaties he is of course opposing EU membership. So I suppose what he really means is not "We want to be in the European Union" so much as "We want to be in a European Union, but not the existing European Union, instead some other imaginary European Union which would not be predicated on the principle of "ever closer union" and which would be and remain just a "flexible, open, trading union."" Or, perhaps he knows very well that he can wring his hands and say that he opposes further integration, but thanks to the arguably treasonable actions of his predecessors it will carry on anyway unless the existing EU treaties are dumped and replaced by treaties which stipulate that there will be just this specified degree of integration, just for these specified purposes, and there will be no further integration beyond that.

having fought in the Second World War as a decorated Navy commander,

Yes and PT-109 wasn't quite what it was made out to be either.

"Is Nigel Farage in next weeks issue ? He's the saviour of the Uk after all (ahem)."

And lo, UKIP was shamelessly crowbarred into another thread.

If David Cameron is Britain's Jack Kennedy, then Nigel Farage is Britain's Dan Quayle, only without the success and intellect.

Kennedy believed in tax cuts so Cameron shares only his background, not his beliefs.

TomTom: "Time Magazine Man of the Year 1938 Adolf Hitler"

The comparison with Hitler is pathetic, and you should be ashamed of yourself. Disgraceful.

Quite so. Hitler is an important historical figure. In ten years' time Cameron will be forgotten.

Running round my head is a wonderful quotation - so apposite - about a "Camelot of plastic gnomes". Not sure who made it, or about whom, but its time has surely come.

Cameron like Kennedy? Oh no, not that too. Questions about drug taking are bad enough.

Iain Dale likened the glamour, "Kennedyesque glamour", not the people or their politics.

"Britain’s JFK?" is an unashamed invitation from the editor for Cameron bashing. It quite predictably descended into farce within the first two posts. What was the point?

"His telegenic appeal has propelled the Tories to a consistent lead in opinion polls for the first time since Tony Blair's 1997 victory. That has infused Britain's Conservatives with a sensation so unfamiliar, they barely recognize it: optimism."

This certainly applies to some on here.

I'm looking forward to "DC the movie".

I seem to remember that "JFK" started with some cigar-chomping hood repeatedly snarling "He's a Bullsh*t President"

Confronted with "Dave", I feel his pain.

The polls are a lie. 34% is consistently factored out (and the headline figure recalculated accordingly) as being, not "Don't Know", but firmly determined not to vote.

Socially conservative economic populists, thus doubly opposed to the neocon war agenda, determined the American midterms and have just seen their Senate-clinching standard-bearer deliver the Democratic Party's official response to the State of the Union Address.

So, where and when will the touchpapers be lit across Europe, North America and the Antipodes? In America in 2008, or in Britain in 2009?

Either way, the flames will take no time to consume so light a weight as David Cameron. And JFK? Cameron might be debauched, but is he really as bad at THAT?

>>Cameron might be debauched, but is he really as bad at THAT?<<

Whatever Dave's past (alleged) activities in the "stuff" field, he certainly seems unable to match JFK's reputation as an amateur swordsman.

All the women I have asked find him rather unattractive and "geeky" with what has been described by one journalist as "a strange melted bent-in face"

His alleged sex-appeal appears to be a product of some overheated media imagination.

All this just reinforces the idea that Blair is a modern Nixon...

Just the kind of typical superficial rubbish you'd expect from the Americans.

100% American 99% idiot.

I can guess people would sniff something when Gregory Barker MP is around given his lurid personal life.

"his wife Samantha-the daughter of a baronet, who sports a tattoo of a dolphin on her ankle"

That doesn't surprise me in the least. I wouldnt be surprised if some of Camerons Notting Hill set have rings through various parts of their anatomy.

Poor old Kennedy got elected once thanks to 300.000 votes and Mayor Daley stuffing the ballot-boxes in Cook County...quite a steal of an election

What lovely people you all are. It makes me proud to read you

"Britain's JFK?"

If JFK stands for "John F. Kerry", yes, probably.

My God! Both McCartney and Irvine posting on the same thread. How much bigoted bile are they going to spout now?

Like who?

JFK the womaniser?

JFK the cocaine addict (originally to treat his Addisons disease) ?

or

JFK the gunslinging boy hero who gave mankind its best ever view of the gates of hell?

You choose...

There are 2 types of people in life - Whingers and Doers. Awful lot of Whingers on this site. I am glad the party is changing and I am glad we are doing better in the polls and in local elections. Frankly I am beginning to feel more every day that if some people don't want to help they can sod off. I think we will be the better for it,

Matt

Some pretty unpleasant posts on this thread which is a shame.

I do hope no one within the party is using the term nasty party. It does us no good.

Not enough prison space to send a convicted paedophile to jail and yet we have to endure this level of debate on CH.

Not enough prison space to send a convicted paedophile to jail and yet we have to endure this level of debate on CH.

I know it's off-topic, but I've just heard a fantastic indictment of the failure in this area from none other then Geoff Hoon on BBC's Question Time (I may be paraphrasing slightly):

Hoon:"Yes, when burglars get out of prison, they burgle again..."
Anne Atkins:"Well, haven't you thought about doing something more effective?"

Some days I wonder if we're suffering under a singular failure of imagination in public policy from this government now as much as anything else.

On Matt's point, I have to agree that the above suggests that we "do-ers" need to stick together! I would say, though, that we shouldn't allow occasional frustration to make us impatient and intolerant in making our case and explaining our political approach to those who have reasonably-held concerns and questions, but that we should make every effort to bring them along with us.

"Whingers and Doers", eh? If Camerloon had kept his election promise to withdraw from the EPP, there'd be a lot less whingeing here, methinks...

JFK the cocaine addict (originally to treat his Addisons disease) ?

That's very new...I thought he was dosed on steroids to treat back pain...unfortunately this leads over time to brittle bones

>>My God! Both McCartney and Irvine posting on the same thread. How much bigoted bile are they going to spout now?<<

Oh dear Malcolm! Aren't we a sad sourpuss?

You should smile more. I recommend it.

Try reading some of the hilarious comments on this thread.

I've just taken the time to read this article on-line. It is actually rather sarcastic with some interesting quotes which I am sure will be reused against Cameron.

The headline is not "Man of the Year" but "Britain's Boy Wonder"!!!

Here are some of the best extracts:

"Actually, Cameron has more in common with a certain British pol than he does with J.F.K."

"the same rootless accent that in Britain indicates an easy start in life"

"Cameron inspires suspicion as well as excitement"

"That's where the trouble begins. It's easy enough to locate Cameron's heart...The wellsprings of his political conviction are harder to trace."

"Cameron rarely invokes the name of the Tories' biggest icon: Margaret Thatcher. "To me, Mrs. Thatcher — it's all a long time in the past,"

"So far, though, Cameron has avoided making many explicit policy statements, relying instead on warm and fuzzy ideas like a belief in "social responsibility" that he says will empower business, individuals and local government. But in Britain's red-meat political and media landscape, warm and fuzzy is rarely enough. Popular attitudes to politicians are still set by the tabloids, which take no prisoners. And so far, the red tops aren't convinced. "I can't get to grips with Cameron, and I don't think the electorate can," says Trevor Kavanagh, the longtime political voice of the Sun. Here's a warning for the conservative comer: if the Sun thinks you're not substantial enough, that's a weighty problem to worry about."

>>>> JFK the cocaine addict (originally to treat his Addisons disease) ? <<<<

Obliquely referred to in Wikipiedia and in a kiss 'n tell book by a Secret Service agent who was detailed to buy JFK's stash. Addisons is a disease that cripples the adrenal gland and renders the sufferer prone to crushing fatigue/depression...the sixties remedy was party drugs although things have moved on since then...thank god!!!

Kennedy had his political career bought and paid for by old man Joe, his father, who was as corrupt as they come.
Joe's tenure as Yankee ambassador to GB during the war was marked by pro-Nazi/isolationist trends.
Joe's links with organised crime certainly helped JFK win the White House, and who knows may well have caused his hit after he screwed up Cuba and the mob lost its gambling ops and then RFK went against the mafia.
As for the rest, womanising and drugs i hardly think the comparison fair on ole man Dave.

Yes the article isn't bad at all. It's certainly no transatlantic version of the breathess Rachel Sylvester/Alice Thomson witterings now thankfully absent from the pages of the Telegraph.

Much as I enjoy Heffer's great hammer blows againts Bluelabour the stilleto can be even more deadly

So who will fill the roles of Fiddle and Faddle in the new Camelot?

This thread really plummets the depths of snide asides and bile that I have so far seen on this site and thats saying something.
The comparison with Kennedys charisma and the fact that he was seen as a leader for a new generation and a break with the past is justified and correct. I also think that the Cameron does try to appeal to peoples highest ideals the way Kennedy did.
Cameron shares some principles with Kennedy but I think some on this thread seem to forget that Kennedy was a Democrat so you wouldn`t expect Cameron to agree with everything kennedy stood for.
I will not repeat the bile and insults but just to say that when your opponents and those right-wingers are Camerons opponents regardless if they call themselves Conservative or not resort to that sort of name calling and schoolyard politics you know things are going very well indeed!

The comparison with Kennedys charisma and the fact that he was seen as a leader for a new generation and a break with the past is justified and correct.

Kennedy STOLE the Election from Richard Nixon with the connivance of Major Richard Daley of Chicago. I believe it was 300.000 votes.

Jack Stone may favour electoral fraud - he might wish to join Labour - but it frankly stinks that the Kennedy Clan thought they could buy their way there - Joe Kennedy Sr had Joe Jr lined up for the Presidency but he was killed so he then paid for John to be elected

Educational Update for Jack Stone:

In the 1960 presidential race Richard M. Nixon lost by a hair to John F. Kennedy.

Two states with razor-thin margins for Kennedy could have swung the election to Nixon: Kennedy carried Texas by only 46,000 votes, and he carried Illinos by a mere 9,000 votes.

Illinois was then, and is now, dominated by Democratic machine politicians the kings of which are the Daley family of Chicago fame.

Democratic Campaign Chair, William Daley, is the son of the late Chicago Mayor Richard J. Daley who was instrumental in "stealing" the 1960 election from Nixon. Bill Daley is also brother to the current Chicago Mayor, Richard Daley, Jr.

In the aftermath of 1960 virtual non-election, investigators were alarmed by the fact that on election eve the Republicans were leading in Illinois but Daley’s operatives were withholding the results of a large number of precincts for some worrisome reason.

Then, when Kennedy was just four electoral votes shy of winning the presidency, all of the missing Chicago precincts mysteriously reported at the same time, turning the tide in favor of Kennedy.

There were 68 million votes cast in the 1960 election. The margin between the Republicans and the Democrats (Nixon and Kennedy) was a trifling 113,000 (less than 2/10 of one percent!) in favor of Kennedy.

A subsequent investigation of vote fraud in Illinois and Texas revealed the following:

Fannin County, Texas had only 4,895 registered voters. BUT 6,138 votes were cast, 75% of which went to Kennedy.

Angelina County, Texas: In one precinct, only 86 people voted yet the final tally was 147 for Kennedy, 24 for Nixon.

But Texas refused to conduct a recount. The Texas Election Board consisted entirely of Democrats, and the Board certified John Kennedy the winner in Texas.

Illinois: News reporters witnessed so much voter fraud by the Democrats that the Chicago Tribune stated "the election of November 8 was characterized by such gross and palpable fraud as to justify the conclusion that [Nixon] was deprived of victory." (As quoted by the Washington Post.)

The Republican National Committee filed a lawsuit challenging the Chicago results. Not coincidentally, the lawsuit was assigned to the courtroom of a judge known to be friendly to Daley and the Democratic party, Circuit Court Judge Thomas Kluczynski. After predictably dismissing the Republican suit, Kluczynski was rewarded by "President" John F. Kennedy with an appointment to the federal bench.

Earl Mazo was a reporter for the New York Herald Tribune in 1960. He investigated charges of Chicago voter fraud in the 1960 Kennedy / Nixon elections. Mazo found a cemetary in one Chicago precinct where the names on the head stones were registered voters who had actually voted!

Reporter Mazo also visited the Chicago address where 56 Kennedy voters listed their address. What he found was an abandoned, demolished house.

After numerous Democratic judges dismissed Republican charges of voter fraud, Kennedy was inaugurated.

Following Kennedy’s inauguration, the U.S. Department of Justice performed an inconclusive investigation into the accumulated evidence of voter fraud. The head of the DOJ was none other than U.S. Attorney General Bobby Kennedy, brother of you-know-who.

This summary is based on the story "Another Race to the Finish" by Peter Carlson, published in the Washington Post, 11/17/00, Page A01
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A36425-2000Nov16?language=printer ]

Cameron like JFK
If the feed back I'm getting from Party members is anything to go by, metaphorically they'll be queuing up to get into the Book Depository or failing that looking for the Grassy Knoll.
By the way, you know that "Cameron" means crooked nose in Gaelic-mind you "Campbell" means crooked mouth

I think Camerons emphasis on social responsibility is exactly the direction we have to take to renew this country. Keep at it,

Matt

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