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Thanks for that info, I was looking for something to counter the local Lib Dem newsletter comment about the Bromley result, the above will do just fine in our local "In Touch".

I think we do need to take the threat posed by the liberals seriously. My area has seen the a decline in conservative votes that has been matched by the rise in the Lib Dem vote. Pushing conservaties from 2nd to 4th place. We need some sort of campaign thart will bet these 'liberal conservatives' back into the fold.

especially since next years Scottish elections look like they could be the death of labour, we need to make sure that we capitalise on the former tory votes otherwise we could find ourselves squeezed out by labour voters turning to the lib dems.

I would also suggest that a Lib Dem style bar graph is in order - with two very close red and blue lines (and a yellow one nowhere near) saying "Only the Conservatives can get Labour out of Government."

Now the tables have turned!

What if UKIP come out with a bar chart of laws made in Brussels compared to laws made in Westminster and says "A Tory vote is a wasted vote"? What then, eh?

This IS a really important insight. The best thing we have against the LibDims is that we are the main party of opposition. (Charles Kennedy understood this and that is why he droned on about his party being the real party of opposition.)
Tories can replace Labour in a clean, certain way. LibDems can't. CCHQ should be working on ad campaigns to bring this home to voters. Perhaps it is a job for the Chameleon Army?

UKIP are possibly about to amalgamate with the DUP and the BNP to form the BDIP. That would persuade the Conservatives and Lib Dems to join forces in a big way - if this new alliance gets off the ground.
see http://rightlinks.co.uk/linked/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=298&forum=7&post_id=1129#forumpost1129

It's load of tosh, William.

UKIP and the DUP would not touch the BNP with the proverbial barge-pole.

Selsdon Man I don't think the DUP would go anywhere near the BNP but would be less confident of saying that about UKIP, who appear to be all over the place at the moment.

I'm very suspicious about this defection. A particular part of the news article sticks out like a sore thumb:

"Mr Graham won his seat in a 58 per cent turnout in May 2003, beating the Conservative candidate by 27 votes."

ie. there's an election next year and I might lose my seat if I stand again as a LibDem

Just back from Built to Last at Southampton where I suggested to my neighbour at table that the 20 word summary for 'Vote conservative because...' could be " to get these b*******s out and have a real government. Great minds :-)

Conservative eurosceptic MEP's are abandoning the delegation to the euro parliament.

Heaton Harris is going to fight Daventry, and Hannan is going to fight the new constituency of Meon Valley in Hampshire I am told by [email protected]

Will a new bunch of hearty eurosceptics be tempted to fight for seats as MEP's after seeing what's happened to the last lot?

BNP are targetting UKIP's vote - if we are seen as europhile after Hague's shocking climbdown and threat of deselections, how will we be able to fight to keep our EU Parliament seats?

Roger Helmer has yet to declare his intentions. Being a bit older than the others, I guess he'll consider retirement.

If there is no formal amalgamation of UKIP/BNP, the voters will probably do it for them and back BNP.

There is a kind of polarisation happening. Conservative eurosceptics leaving the euro parliament, while bnp are targetting it.

correction - Hannan at this stage hopes to be selected for the seat.

Hello Ted @ 22.17 - I was at the meeting in Southampton too, I wonder what table you were at?

Im aware of a former Labour Councillor who has written a letter for the local paper in support of the local Conservatives down here in Thanet.

Im afraid on the wider question of voting Conservative, people need a positive reason to vote the Conservatives in. The hug a hoodie line has really stuck. Its going to hurt us badly. Thanet has a lot of issues and Im not convinced Camerons providing the answers I, and other Conservatives, are looking for to support our own election campaigns next year.

Im worried about the Lib Dems, which here in Thanet have never done very well but are always the protest vote. They might pick up a fair few votes like last year here.


I was the guy who asked what the Conservatives would do to support the family & reduce complexity of tax credits/family credits. Was OK with Willets response on family but will write to him about complexity of tax credits - there must be a better way.

Where were you?

I thought it was a bit like a thread on CHOme - the core v the Cameroons split was quite apparent.



Hug a hoodie was Labour spin but you have a point. PMQs Labour questons about EPP, Hug a Hoodie, Second class MPs etc aren't being challenged. We have good replies so why not give them?

ie Labour sits alongside former communists and parties with some odd beliefs; the importance of the father figure, family support & other IDS initiatives in removing the drivers for youth misbehaviour; better "second class" MPs than second class citizens.

Dizzy is reporting the final three for Eltham are Jackie Doyle-Price, David Gold and Eric Ollerenshaw

UKIP are possibly about to amalgamate with the DUP and the BNP to form the BDIP.
The fact is that the DUP is not a racist party unlike the BNP, Nick Griffin is a Roman Catholic in addition and Ian Paisley's Church The Free Presbyterian Church of Ulster has close links with The Orthodox Presbyterian Church of the Cameroon and it also has congregations throughout the world including one in Lahore apparently, Ian Paisley has been cultivating links with African churches especially and is on good terms with many - he is not about to make a deal with a Racist Papist - you fail to realise that in fact the BNP supports enforced desegregation of schools in Ulster and this is anathema to most Unionists and in fact many on the other side as well.

If there is no formal amalgamation of UKIP/BNP, the voters will probably do it for them and back BNP.
The BNP make some gains in council seats and then lose them again, they claim droves of new members and it turns out to be 146, if people who had voted UKIP had wanted to back the BNP then they could have done so already, the BNP is going nowhere and has no actual power at any level because even the councillors they do get don't do anything.

Cameron's heading for the 'centre ground' to pick up Lib Dem voters. Ming's heading left to pick up Labour voters.

No one's got their nets out on the right (whatever that means).

Licensing of political parties is expected to eliminate eurosceptic parties, so the right/eurosceptic vote will have nowhere to go.

That's the strategic position. Will it work as Big Brother is planning?

BTW YAA, the BNP claim that they are forcing the building of new council housing in east london, where their councillors were elected.

The last conservative government was noted for its sleeze. We now have a government that has measurably outsleezed it. Is there not a clear lesson here that everyone desperatly ignores?
There is a fundamental flaw in our democracy and we have a metropolitan political party class gorging itself on the public purse. Before you can say knife they will now start helping themselves to the taxpayer's money for their party funds. How long before those party overdrafts are written off by the taxpayer, on the say so of their "elected representatives"?
Conservative, Labour, Lib Dem. are we so dim that we still think there is any difference, or that any of them are interested inanything but themselves?

Ming's heading left to pick up Labour voters.
Meinzes Campbell's going down and the Liberal Democrat's look like they are going to be back where they were in 1970 in a relatively short space of time, Meinzes Campbell himself evidently is something of a spent force - certainly a very well intentioned pleasant man, probably the most so of the main party leaders but to quote a phrase "Not fit for purpose".

BTW YAA, the BNP claim that they are forcing the building of new council housing in east london, where their councillors were elected.
They claim all sorts of things that later turn out to be untrue or with the slightest investigation were obviously mere propaganda.

Also I'm not really clear exactly why new Council House Building would be particularily likely to attract Conservative or UKIP voters to vote BNP even if it were true, most people know that the BNP's main agenda is the old NF one of "Send the wogs home" and unless they agree with this they are unlikely to switch to it, UKIP are closest to being able to win a parliamentary seat - any MP's leaving the Conservative Party are likely to switch to UKIP, the English Democrats, or to form a new party or even ally themselves with one of Ulster's Unionist Parties, Enoch Powell for example joined the Ulster Unionist Party.

Ted - sorry I'm late with a reply, but I went to bed earlier than usual last night, probably tired after the travelling!

I was sitting at a table with two other men, on the inner side of the two columns of tables, and very near the bar.

I liked everything that David Willetts had to say - as far as it went, but I suppose inevitably, there were several areas I would have liked to have discussed in more detail, and I got rather bored with people saying that we must get more people to go and live 'up north'. With so little time for discussion,and a rather haphazard technique of collecting up points for David Willetts to answer, it rather taxed ones patience to listen to long-winded, very personal declarations of religious convictions! Did you clap when a gentleman made a short speech, which attempted to restate the political priorities of today? I did!

Patsy - you must have been very close to me (if not at same table?).

I agree that the event wasn't properly chaired and while I liked what Willets said, liked his defence against the inevitable attack on wooly, fuffy toryism andon development I felt that a better method would have been a more pro-active chairperson who sought discussion. Perhaps if they had said we'd spend half hour on first point then same on second and Willets had moved around tables stimulating discussion we'd have had a more lively meeting.

Still I liked the little bit of nationalist pride Willets did at end about how we Brits were more individualistic because of our herritage of common law rather than Roman. Probably because I agreed!

Ted - Yes that last bit was quite new to me, I felt I would have liked to hear more about that.

The lady who was the chairperson was a stand-in, because the person who should have been, was unable to due to buckled rails!!!! Do you remember her saying that? Maybe she would have organised it differently.

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I agree that the event wasn't properly chaired and while I liked what Willets said, liked his defence against the inevitable attack on wooly, fuffy toryism andon development I felt that a better method would have been a more pro-active chairperson who sought discussion.

In terms of unseating the LibDems across the south of England that may be an important insight.


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