David Davis leads charge against ID cards

David Davis has led Tory opposition to Labour's ID cards bill.  Here are some of the main points from his Commons speech...

THE GOVERNMENT'S SUGGESTION THAT ID CARDS ARE VOLUNTARY

Referring to the provision that would make ID cards obligatory on renewal of a passport...

"Not if your work takes you abroad, they aren’t [voluntary].  Not if your parents live abroad, or your spouse or partner is from abroad, they aren’t.  Not if your children travel abroad and get sick or into trouble, they aren’t.  And it is a novel interpretation of voluntary that the price of a foreign holiday is a requirement to be put on the National Identity Register."

GOVERNMENT ABUSE OF DATA IT HOLDS

"Now, after the way this government treated Martin Sixsmith, Pam Warren, Rose Addis and others, seeking information about them and using it to destroy their reputations, I would not trust them with data about my life."

"THE PLASTIC POLL TAX"

"Even on the government's figures, the price of passports for a family of four will go from £134 today to £372.  On the LSE’s figures, the cost could be as high as £300, per person, or more than £1,000 for a family of four.  A plastic poll tax that no one will volunteer to pay."

GOVERNMENT INCOMPETENCE

"Even simple databases are beyond the Home Office, such as the firearms register which they were asked to set up 8 years ago which is still not operational.  If they are incapable of setting up a firearms register in eight years, why should we imagine that they are capable of setting up the register required under this Bill in an acceptable and workable way?"

THE FACT THAT THE ID CARDS DATABASE WILL HAVE 20,000 ACCESS POINTS

"Microsoft’s national technology officer has said that a central identity database could worsen the very problems it was intended to prevent, such as terrorism and identity theft.  He said that “ministers should not be building systems that allow hackers to mine information so easily.”

ID CARDS ARE CONSISTENT WITH OTHER ATTEMPTS TO RESTRICT BRITISH CIVIL LIBERTIES

"The way the government has gone about trying to deliver this Bill is of a piece with so much of what they have done to then hard-won rights of British people.  The gradual erosion of jury trial.  The attempt to criminalise free speech.  Stopping some people making peaceful protests, while ignoring others inciting violence.  Locking people up for months without charge or trial.  The increasing retention of more and more data on innocent people – even DNA samples of innocent children."

Comments

[James Maskell]

The amendment of legislation prior to making ID cards compulsory has been passed without a vote.

However it will be compulsory for people to be given ID cards - and put on a register - when you apply for a passport.

http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/4707608.stm

[Chad]

How many people will be "losing" their passports just near the end of 2007 so they can get a new 10 year one without the burden of the new id card etc?

I wouldn't condone it of course.... ;-)

[Chris]

Youcan apply for a new passport before the expiry date without losing it. You even get credited with the extra time that you haven't used in some cases. I have an 11 years and 3 month passport if I recall correctly, as I had to renew my passport early due to visa restrictions in a country I was about to visit.

[James Maskell]

Latest update...costings amendment overturned... A report every six months for the first 10 years of the scheme not full costings prior to the scheme.

Labour pulled off just what they want. Goodbye to civil liberties and tens of billions of pounds from the taxpayer.

[Elena]

It's so irritating that the government are doing this when what's really needed is greater police presence. That's what makes people feel safe and secure, not some ID Card based around a central database (how long does anyone give it before it's hacked into?) THAT isn't going to give people peace of mind.

My passport doesn't run out until 2014, think. Maybe I'll pretend to lose it and get an extra year or two!

[James Maskell]

I refuse to buy an ID card. I know that the ID Card will come with a passport so I will simply not renew my passport.

[God]

I'd like to say to the good radical right-wing ultra neo-conservative republican citizens of America: If there is a faltering congressional republican, scandal ridden, government official in your area and your federal funds dry up, don't turn to your local police force or FBI. You have rejected the constitutional law of the land in lieu of patriarchal and theocratic dogma. Don’t wonder why the police force or FBI hasn't helped you when your problems begin, if they begin. I'm not saying they will, but if they do, just remember, you just put your faith in your father GOD. If that's the case, don't ask for his help because he might not be there, because it just might be GOD’S WRATH."
Signed, [the real] Pat Robertson

[Martin Smith]

You can go to http://www.pledgebank.com/refuse and pledge not to sign up for an ID card....

[James Maskell]

So it would cost me 10 quid to prove that I dont want to buy an ID card...screw that. Im not giving money to them to prove what I believe in. I just wont buy an ID card or renew my passport. If legal aid is as easy to get as it is for so many other people, the defense fund isnt required...

[wasp]

I'm very disappointed with Davis on this, the support for ID cards is soft but people seem to be accepting them, I don't know if its just me but I feel there should be outrage at this.

[TC]

Davis' speech raised some excellent points. This defenence of the individual against the state makes me proud to be a tory.

[malcolm]

I am simply amazed that this thread has attracted so few posts in comparison to those about polls which seem to attract the same posters making the same points again and again and again.
The key points for me regarding ID Cards is will they work? The governments case here is utterly woeful.Even Lord Carlile has said that ID cards will provide little protection against terrorists.
The fact that we lost the vote yesterday is a tragedy.I hope the Lords send it back once more.

[William Norton]

Is it true that Paul Keech, Lib Dem MP, voted for the Govmt?

[Chris Palmer]

It's either everyone has an ID card or nobody does. This half-hearted, some will have one, some won't is completely pointless and a waste of taxpayers money... again.

[johnC]

Agreed. What's the point of ID cards if they are not universal ? It would make more sense to require everyone to have a passport. Most people already have one, and it would be a fraction of the cost. Future UK passports could include extra data such as fingerprints if that was important.

[wasp]

The point is not that they will be expensive and won't work the point is that a future government with less scruples than Blair would be able to wield incredible power over the individuals through this register. eg if the BNP won an election is could be used to register race information and be used as a tool for discrimination.

[Graeme Archer]

I will go to prison before I carry an ID card. No government is going to force my body against a biometric scanner and record such details about me. No privacy = no intimacy. Has Blair not read his namesake's novel?

[John Hustings]

"The point is not that they will be expensive and won't work the point is that a future government with less scruples than Blair would be able to wield incredible power over the individuals through this register."

A government with less scruples than Blair? Is that possible?

Oh wait, maybe David Cameron..

[Spagbob]

go go davis

[EML]

Does anyone know when the Lords will get another chance to re-introduce their amendments? Or will they? I read this morning that they may back down and settle for the very small concessions the Government have offered.